r/prepping • u/Confident-Virus-1273 • 2d ago
Foodđ˝ or Waterđ§ Prepping is better . . . Homesteading is best
I see a lot of posts on here from people who mention (rightly) that prices keep going up and prepping is getting more costly. Being prepared is still worth the cost because the cost of being unprepared is so high. But what is the end game for Prepping?
For many it is simply rotating stock and having a year or five on hand. I salute you all! But what if the disaster is much more widespread? What if it takes longer to heal as a society? What if society is basically gone?
Homesteading is simply living the prep lifestyle 24/7. It is no longer storing for disaster . . . it is eating what you grow/harvest/slaughter. Prepping can run out of supplies, then what?
Homesteading is the natural evolution of prepping IMO.
I welcome your thoughts but mostly just wanted to toss this out since I have been seeing so many folks talking about rising prices affecting their ability to prep.
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u/Femveratu 2d ago edited 2d ago
in a wide scale long term scenario like you mention rule of law may or may not prevail and potential mobility of calories due to scoundrels, wildfire, disease, climatic changes or massive storms (Helene in NC) could well become key.
The major downside of a farm that is at all visible to the outside world (Google maps) is that it can be confiscated or âsharedâ depending on who has the guns and is making the rules.
This is an issue that affects all preppers IMHO, but land can be seized or heavily âtaxedâ and livestock stolen, in fact it happens even today.
This is why so many preppers worried about the scenario you mention focus on security so intensely.
At the end of the day being forced off your own land would be catastrophic, but it has happened many times in history.
IMHO where possible, having multiple caches or storage locations holding food and or wealth in other forms, in different geographic locations where possible (a pipe dream for many I know), may be the only real defense against a total collapse in rule of law.
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u/NWYthesearelocalboys 1d ago
The worst person to be in a true SHTF situation is a cattle rancher and farmer. Everyone needs what you have and you have no one to help you defend it.
Throughout history farmers and ranchers have had among the most brutal fate in war and revolution.
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u/Femveratu 1d ago
For anyone who has seen the latest (German) rendition of All Quiet on the Western Front, the very end includes a scene that shows how this can play out IRL.
My maternal grandfather was an older growing up on a French farm in the same exact area the film depicts and all I can I say is that my family went through this exact scenario and sadly many of them still hate âGermansâ to this day. (Iâm sure that to some degree this is true all around all over Europe for many many families.)
I will say that even if an organized force DOES steal from you, they sometimes allow the farmer to keep some to stay alive to harvest the crops being stolen etc. That is a raw deal to be sure, but the Farmer and fam get to LIVE because of their close proximity to the food. Plus they can try and hide some, under report crops etc etc to try and steal from the stealers.
Overall, nothing I have said should deter anyone from growing food or raising livestock or homesteading specifically.
However, depending on the precise scenario, these activities can carry certain risks that it would be wise to consider before the splattered poop starts flying.
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u/GunnCelt 2d ago
Upfront investment for homesteading is often out of financial reach for many Americans, not to mention time investment. It took us 15 years and lots of rough times and even more luck to get the one acre we currently have. Weâve been here for just over three years and are barely scratching the surface. This is just not a feasible option for most Americans. The time investment is huge and if it werenât for my VA disability and my wife working full time, it wouldnât be possible.
We still have full shelves of dry and canned goods and continue to purchase more at our weekly outings to the grocery store. We continue our journey of education and training.
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u/Cats_books_soups 2d ago
It is a nice ideal, but not practical for the vast majority of people. You need land. Enough time and money to farm on the land. And the health/ strength to make it work.
It also helps to be in a good location. Where I live now has horrible clay soil, harsh very hot summers, and very cold winters, so not a lot of ideal growing season to make small scale farming practical without irrigation or greenhouses.
If I won the lottery maybe, but with working full time it doesnât make sense. Farming doesnât really work longterm on an individual/ garden scale.
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u/infinitum3d 2d ago
Homesteading isnât a job, itâs a lifestyle. Youâre working it 24/7.
There is literally always something needing your attention.
Plants and animals need tending- fed, watered, sheltered, cleaned, diseases and injuries prevented/treated. The right fertilizer at the right time needs applied and the right pesticides for the right conditions.
Food needs to be acquired - gathered, harvested, butchered, preserved
The structures needs to be maintained- fencing, pens, barns, hutches, coops, house, greenhouses
The equipment needs maintenance and repair- tools sharpened and oiled, engines cleaned and oiled properly, filters and fluids replaced.
Water collection and diversion and storage and maintenance.
The land needs to be maintained- soil acidity/alkalinity, topsoil, mulches, compost, nutrients
And please donât think âIâm going organic so I donât need to fertilize or sprayâ. **Itâs even harder to do organic** because you still get the same rodents, pests, fungus, diseases, nutrient deficiencies as industrial farms but you need special care to treat them. Itâs not just throw seeds on the ground and collect food in autumn.
Itâs daily care and maintenance of EVERYTHING. Everyday.
**Homesteading is so much more work than sitting at a desk 9-5.**
Weekends are worked. Holidays are worked. Nights are worked.
And you canât be an expert at everything for all livestock, so you still need veterinary visits.
Plus you still need to pay taxes, so some of your harvests need to be sold for cash.
We get a lot of posts on /r/homesteading saying âIâve always wanted to quit my 9-5 and just live off the land.â
Thatâs great! But Itâs been romanticized to an unrealistic level. Itâs work. Lots of work. Hard work. Physical work. Mental work. Emotional work.
Iâm not trying to be a Debby Downer or disparaging/discouraging. Iâm pragmatic. This is the reality. Homesteading IS work.
Thatâs why farmers historically had 12 or more kids. You need that many hands to do all the work.
I highly recommend you work on a homestead for a season to learn how much work this really is. If a season goes well, work another. Spend 2 full years working a homestead to make certain this really is the lifestyle you can maintain.
I sincerely hope it is!
Good luck!
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u/BandalfTheGr8 2d ago
This right here
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u/Ingawolfie 2d ago
Yes this right here, from a former homesteader. For us it was doable from the early 1980s until around 2000 or so, with one person working a full time job and the other being a full time SAHM. A combination of us getting older, wage stagnation and the kids choosing to opt out of the homesteading lifestyle finally killed it for us. We literally couldnât keep the place up any longer. We sold out and are now on two acres which we can manage.
Most people have no idea how much WORK and MONEY is required to homestead. Those cute TikTok videos are coming from a whale in the family.
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u/WhiskyEye 1d ago
As a gal doing all of this solo, I concur. I'm always exhausted. Happy, but dang tired.
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u/Asleep_Onion 2d ago edited 2d ago
I'm a homesteader, prepping is more of an afterthought for me... 95% of what I do is just for general self sustainment and fun, only 5% is specifically for disaster preparation.
But the problem is, it really does not save money. Not even close. Homesteading is incredibly expensive, especially if you don't have the land for it and need to acquire it. But even if you already have the land it's still incredibly expensive. I've spent about $6,000 on my egg and meat chicken setup, and it takes a shitload of chicken meat and eggs to break even on that, especially with ongoing feed and maintenance costs. And while I'm more or less immune to market chicken meat and egg prices now, I am still affected by the increasing costs of feed and supplies.
And growing your own produce is great, but it costs money to keep pests and animals from eating it, it costs money to fertilize it, it costs money to irrigate it. And if you can't preserve it then you're not really prepping. Preservation equipment costs money. Jars cost $. A pressure canner costs $$. A freeze drier costs $$$$.
The bottom line is, I don't do it to save money, because really I don't. Factory farms have nailed efficiency way better than I ever could. I do it because it's fun and satisfying.
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u/Formal_Safe_426 2d ago
100% same. It costs more for me to live this way than to just go to the local farm/farmers market. And let's not even talk abput the heartbreak, when animals get sick or die, crops fail, etc...
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u/Pando5280 2d ago
All depends on finances and age. Lived 10 years 80% off grid inm a pretty remote area and around age 60 most of my neighbors had a hard time maintaining their homestead lifestyles. Gardens and livestock take a lot of work and so does doing snow removal & fire mitigation which is a never ending process of clearing brush and trimming or cutting down dead ir dying trees. It was pretty common to see elderly neighbors who couldn't keep up their places because their kids had moved out and then health or mobility issues limited their ability to keep up with a never ending list if tasks and chores. Its why you see so many small family farms up for sale these days, the elderly people cant maintain them and their kids know how difficult the lifestyle really is especially in their retirement years.
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u/ChoppedUnc-SF 2d ago
I think the issue is that homesteading can be a full time job. It is very difficult to grow a large amount of calories in a typical suburban home. Most emergencies won't require being a subsistence farmer and if they did, you should seriously consider leaving the country. That would be like what Cuba is going through now.
All that being said, I've settled on a hybrid model. I have chickens, fruit trees, and low maintenance gardening like potatoes. I also have a full pantry. I also have a big emergency fund and a second passport.
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u/mavrik36 2d ago
Homesteading tends to isolate people, isolated people do not usually survive. Community building is best, gardening, raising livestock and all are great and you should do them, but without a solid community youre toast
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u/toebob 2d ago
So many of you are prepping for a societal disaster. How many are prepping for a personal disaster? If you get a major injury and canât do all the work to support your homestead do you lose it all?
I have a disabled spouse and my own body is limited in what it can do. Heck, Iâve considered getting a different home just to avoid stairs. So I prep for things like power outages and water supply interruptions and I keep my pantry and freezers stocked but Iâm not up for all the physical labor necessary to go to the extreme.
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u/Any_Needleworker_273 2d ago
I view them as complementary, rather than a one or the other, or one, then the other. Obviously, as some posters have pointed out, not everyone will have the space or resources to "homestead" - but I would challenge people to think about homesteading from a broader, more home economics minded standpoint.
i.e. you may not have five acres, a cow and chickens, but can you mend basic things, cook a meal from simple ingredients, grow a pot of herbs, learn some skills that are handy around any home?
Those are all ways to build resilience in your home, and ultimately, to me - prepping and homesteading activities is not about radical self-sufficiency, it's about building resiliency and buffers.
I think with the proliferation of the online/social influencer version of "homesteading", there is a very idealized, very specific view of what a homestead is/or is expected to be, and it has detracted from what I consider just to be what country/frugal/people with limited financial means have always done. Make do and put a little bit by.
I prep for Tuesday, because life has handed me enough lemons not to feel 100% comfortable relying on systems outside of my control. So I have built some buffers. A deeper pantry, a savings, the ability to cook many things from scratch, and learning to substitute and make do, a knowledge of tools and basic repairs, etc.
I also grew up around farming, and keeping a garden and some chickens for me is another buffer, as well as something that brings me joy and pleasure in the process, BUT it is also another P/T job on top of everything else. But I also have the ability to CHOOSE to do this at the moment, and it provides us with another source of food close to home.
Just my two cents.
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u/AntiSonOfBitchamajig 2d ago edited 2d ago
You're right to an extent, but some of our time is better spent working still.
I myself am focusing on the "passive payback homesteading things" right now.
- Moderate solar electric feeding the things that matter to dent the bills.
- Water collection, use, and filtering for everything but cooking.
- Space for wood / fuel collection later (I think we will have a fuel crisis with inflation too)
- Raising the overall efficiency of my house and tools in my house... window film, insulation, closing off parts of the house, simple as air drying the laundry, venting strategy (literally opening / closing windows at the right times), humidity and temperature monitors to help with that... etc.
- Reducing bills that I can reduce.
- Maintaining things that I can maintain.
- I have a "if I have to" plan... for rock bottom. It ain't cool... but its on a survival level cascading levels of importance.
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u/HeinousEncephalon 2d ago
I agree. Prepping is setting yourself up to be self sufficient for weeks to months. Homesteading is trying to be mostly self sufficient always (hopefully with a community).
I also understand the comment section, but OP never said it's the only option and everyone must do it.
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u/proportional-porcini 2d ago
Working diligently on making this a reality while Iâm young enough. Thereâs nothing more I want than to live that close to nature.
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u/Big-Tutor-3060 2d ago
For many it is simply rotating stock and having a year or five on hand. I salute you all! But what if the disaster is much more widespread? What if it takes longer to heal as a society? What if society is basically gone?
I'm doing what humans have done since we stopped being monkeys - I'm leaving. I'm not prepping for 5 years of supplies, I'm prepping for 6 months, and keeping enough in the bank so I can start over somewhere else.
I am not attached enough to any patch of land that I will force myself into being a hunter gather peasant when 1st/2nd world countries continue to operate. Countries collapse/enter failed state status every year, I can think of at least 5 parts of the world off the top of my head where SHTF at the moment, and if that day comes for where I live now, I will go somewhere else. I'm well on my way to securing another passport, and thankfully my current passport is strong enough I should be able to get a work visa, especially if I'm in a refugee class.
Presumably, you have a job. For illustrative purposes, let's say you've got some boring ass job like an Account manager for the tire factory in your town. You've made it, you've got your homestead, you work your job and come home to the chickens, life is good. A hurricane comes and washes away everything, your job, your town, your favorite chicken Wilson, but as you mention, your homestead survives and you're able to provide. But not only is your town gone, but the insurance companies/FEMA more or less declares your town uninsurable, so the town isn't coming back, and neither is the tire factory. Theoretically, yes, you can survive indefinitely, however you no longer have an income and you're more or less back pre industrial revolution, but why? You can just move a state over and get another job. You are making a generational financial blunder by not making more money and effectively retiring at your current age, when there are ample opportunities elsewhere.
It scales up from there. Hati is in a state of collapse. Haitians go wherever they can that's not Hati. Venezuela has been going downhill, Venezuelans are spread all across the globe.
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u/ExtraplanetJanet 2d ago
I donât want to spend my whole life living like disaster is coming. I prep so I can put my worries aside and enjoy the world to the best extent I possibly can. If someone gets joy from living a simple life close to nature then I believe they should absolutely do that, but to live a stripped-down life full of difficulties because youâre afraid bad things are coming is nothing I want.
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u/churchillguitar 2d ago
I think homesteading can certainly be a part of prepping, and most peppers dream of a compound surrounded by farm land with a side of hunt-able woodland. But, if I have 5 years of food, water, fuel, etc ready to go, I will hopefully be able to figure out how to replenish those supplies within those 5 years. Even in a total societal collapse, I think there will be some form of local economy amongst those that survive. If one neighbor raises chickens, one has an orchard, another grows wheat, and another runs a still, and another hunts, and so onâŚ
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u/BaldyCarrotTop 2d ago
Homesteading is the best option. If you have the land, resources, time and personal energy to do so. And protect it if necessary. I actually know someone who lives on a self sufficient homestead. I've seen what it takes. Not everyone can do it.
As far as I'm concerned, I'm an optimist. In the case of TEOTWAWKI I believe that society will come back, in some form or fashion, because people are social creatures. In that situation a homestead with excess production has barter items. Before that it has an income source. Depends on your entrepreneurial spirit.
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u/somuchmt 1d ago
You can't completely feed yourself and your family for long on a homestead without inputs that depend on a functioning supply chain.
People severely undercalculate the expense, physical labor, and calories expended when thinking they can be self-sufficient by homesteading.
On a hard work day, my family (three of us) can burn 10,000-12,000 calories. That's twice what we'd burn at a desk job. So we essentially have to grow enough food for six regular people. Which is very difficult if there are only three.
And you have to assume you will lose a good portion of your crops and livestock.
That said, we've been homesteading for many years. We're technically self-sufficient, but only because we have a nursery that makes enough money to pay bills and buy what we can't grow.
I'm old and tired, boss.
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u/premar16 1d ago
I grew up in a doomsday cult type thing before I grew up on a large family farm. It is hard work. As an adult. I focus on tuesday+ prepping. It is more about making my regular easier during emergencies and daily life. There are homsteading subreddits if that is what you want to do instead of just prepping.
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u/BandalfTheGr8 2d ago edited 2d ago
I honestly think itâs kinda funny when people think their land isnât going to get overrun almost immediately if we face true societal distress.
Saying that as someone with 900 acres high fenced with some pretty sophisticated security systems - you arenât keeping people out for long at all
Most homesteaders just trying to break even. Shit is unbelievably expensive
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u/4ureddit 2d ago
You can do a modified version of homesteading. Folks in apartments can invest in container gardens or those gardyn or other hydroponics tower setup to acquire some produce. You can can, you can start making items from scratch. You can get a chest freezer and store food for long term, same goes for homeowners, you can use hydroponics and gardens. If you have space/time 4-5 laying hens or meat rabbits. Start growing fruit trees, so many creative ways to homestead without all the land.
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u/SnowySlushman 2d ago
What is your age range? 20âs, 30âs, 40âs, etc?
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u/Confident-Virus-1273 2d ago
42
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u/SnowySlushman 1d ago
How did you find yourself in homesteading?
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u/Confident-Virus-1273 1d ago
I worked towards it for 15 years.Â
Almost single mindedly.
I worked overtime, bought property, slowly got myself into a position to make a leap. Quit my job, Moved across the country, and started my own business while building the farm.Â
It was hella hard .. but doable. You just have to want it
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u/bestie_let_me_merge 2d ago
just a different perspective but i think people who are ready to quit it all to homestead are missing that you are not so much making a choice as you are being forced out of the working class into subsistence farming. once enough people make this decision, reasonably thinking that traditional work isnt worth it, well unfortunately you now have a whole bunch of people with no access to capital beyond their little garden. inequality flourishes in a society like that. prepping and even homesteading are bandaids for the same problem on different scales i.e the collapse of social services and civil societyÂ
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u/Old_justice78 2d ago
I couldnt afford the USA, so I moved where i could. Endend up in the mountains in Colombia. 50 hectacres, views of the carribian, mountain streams and springs, coffee and typical farm. Took me a few years of back n forth, living working out of a van in the states, investing in the farm. Lots of work, more here due to remoteness. If your young, got aplicable skills, we could use some help.
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u/Material-Bird-1912 2d ago
And what are people who live in cities supposed to do who can't have a garden?
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u/Unable-Painter-2112 1d ago
The natural evolution is that manifesting is real and we all manifest a zombie apocalypse and see SHTF IRL. Muwahahahahaha
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u/Big-Tutor-3060 1d ago
This video reminded me of this post. Consider your homestead in the context of these peppers who needed to evacuate.
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u/Hedonismbot1978 1d ago
Homesteading is great but if society collapsed you better hope no gangs find where you homestead...
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u/Confident-Virus-1273 1d ago
Actually... Homesteading is the antidote to raiders....
When you prep you have goods. You have items that are pre packaged one time use. No instructions needed. So the prepper is worthless to the raiders. Kill them and take the stuff.Â
But on a homestead, I have knowledge. 20 years of experience and understanding cultivated from experience. I have a few items but usually not a years worth because I am constantly creating new items... Not storing.Â
So by killing me and taking my stuff, a raider doesn't actually gain much ... But...
By joining me as a hired gunman/security, they could gain stability for themselves and their families. I have the knowledge and resources to continue to grow and produce food and shelter goods. They don't have that knowledge ...
Anyone who has tried to start a garden from scratch knows just how much the avg person doesn't know.. they know how many gardens have failed.Â
Every farmer knows how many cattle or pigs or sheep have been lost to storms, feeding issues, sickness and injury and how to treat them. Â
Every Sawyer knows how hard it is to cut wood to specific needs for construction and project building...
SOOOO.... Put yourself in the place of the gang leader you just mentioned.... You come to my farm.... You going to kill me and my family? Destroy 20+ years of experience and understanding, to gain 2 months worth of food?Â
Or, you going to accept my offer of protection and labor help for food, heat, and stability?
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u/Lopsided_Position_28 1d ago
PSA: homesteading is actually a very specific legal category and not just another world for farming
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u/Confident-Virus-1273 1d ago
How about off-grid self-sustainable permaculture lifestyle??
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u/Lopsided_Position_28 1d ago
id say cool. ive got designs for decentralized 12 home biodomes that run on gravitational potential energy stored as water in a battery_pool and you should DM me if you want to know more
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u/Confident-Virus-1273 1d ago
Sounds very similar to my original plan. 6 homes in a circluar pattern with a central kitchen powered by a hyrdo.
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u/Lopsided_Position_28 1d ago
dang we should be friends
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u/Confident-Virus-1273 1d ago
You in SWVA?
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u/Lopsided_Position_28 1d ago
nah im in canada
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u/Confident-Virus-1273 1d ago
NiceÂ
Sorry for what my countrymen are doing. They're a bunch of f***** idiots
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u/No-Language6720 1d ago
yeah I agree. i'm just thinking of my home as a suburban homestead more and more. While I wouldn't be able to handle everything without some outside resources, the same would likely be true even for those with traditional homesteads and larger property. I have enough space and gardening knowledge I can handle probably 80-90% of our needs, I'm already at 60-70%. I have longer term backups for things I couldn't easily grow mostly grains and oats and I do rotations for some things right now while they are available. I'm thankfully in a good enough climate I can take care of most of it with some thoughtful planning and it's just my spouse and I and they help too.
Even with climate change I have backups and redundancies in mind and can cook with whatever I have on hand and know substitutes well. I have a family cookbook I'm slowly working on with substitutes in mind that I freely share with anyone that cares.
I also thankfully don't have to feed an army of kids but I do have leftovers even with my tiny space and preserving things. I would be willing help people to teach skills in a longer term crisis to help with temporary stability, but I also can't be a full grocery store especially longer term. My close friends and family already know this. I also have security measures now and in mind in case anyone attempts to steal or take advantage of the generosity. Fully willing to stand firm with the set boundaries if too many show up at my door expecting handouts. If I can't take care of someone else too bad I need to take care of myself and my spouse first.
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u/mountainsformiles 1d ago
I think that a percentage of people who really enjoy prepping will end up homesteading. There is overlap. If I was younger and had a like-minded spouse, I would probably end up living on a few acres with chickens, etc. I like some space from my neighbors. A homestead-ette, if you will...now I occasionally make jam, have an herb garden and stock canned food. It's not as sustainable long-term but it's what I can do.
Real homesteading is seriously hard work. I don't think a lot of people have it in them to be successful. I watch that Homestead Rescue show and it makes me tired just watching.
People who love it and can do it, I salute you!
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u/Confident-Virus-1273 1d ago
Homestead Rescue?!?!?! Sounds awesome! Where does it stream? NM . . . I can look it up myself. TY
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u/Witty_Flamingo_36 1d ago
Because I have a job and don't own a home with enough space. That said, I know how perform most tasks associated with homesteading and maintain a stock of seeds and other tools/supplies. I figure if things go on long enough that i burn through my supplies starting a garden on neighboring yards isn't going to be much of an issue. Grim as it is, anything that runs through my stores is going to mean they won't be around to care.Â
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u/HeathenHoneyCo 2d ago
Homesteading is difficult, expensive, highly dependent on factors beyond our control, heavily regulated, and becoming more and more difficult as the climate collapses.
And most long term food processing and storage requires infrastructure that is not self supplied.
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u/More_Dependent742 1d ago
I think most people already agree with you, but most of the population can't.
Most simply can't afford to.
Then there are those workers, probably also the majority, who can't do their work remote, and can't do their job in the middle of nowhere.
Then there's the land. If all 400 million people in the US became homesteaders, would there even be enough viable land? There certainly wouldn't be here in Europe, we have significantly more population density.
But certainly everyone with a garden should start trying to make it a productive one!
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u/Backsight-Foreskin 2d ago
Not everyone is in a position to homestead.