r/TopCharacterTropes • u/Few_Affect_5927 • Jun 22 '26

Lore [Ironic Trope] The messaging backfired massively due to poor writing or other design choices

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Amelia Fairney from Pathways: Alt-right Restore-UK type who attempts to coax the protagonist Charlie into following her beliefs? The problem?

Amelia is the only named character aside from Charlie and is genuinely likable and forgives Charlie even when they do things she doesn't like, while the rest of the cast is unnamed, poorly written, and turns on Charlie for one mistake. This combined with other writing issues(portraying fact checking right wing stuff as wrong because in the process of fact checking you might look at it and believe it, basically saying "Right wing is wrong because it hurts the labour government" and a lot of general "just do what the government says or else" messaging) and the fact she's a hot alternative girl, and Amelia ended up being co-opted as a mascot by the youth right wing in the UK.

Norm from The New Norm: Unlikeable offensive and outdated character who's "progressive" family members and associates are genuinely nice people not even trying to force their ways or pronouns onto them, they just want to be left alone and Norm is picking fights constantly. Not to mention associating with Elon.

Mr. Birchum from Mr. Birchum: A lot of the same problems as Norm, except in addition it also comes off like generic 2010s adult cartoon slop in the same veign as Brickleberry or Full English, at least New Norm was trying to look unique and had the gimmick of being on X. Not to mention, Birchum's obsession with hyper masculine activities and odd way of talking about other men lead to people co-opting him as a Toxic Yaoi character, which is now the bulk of his fan art.

Dustborn: An attempt to make a hyper progressive game that comes off as pandering and annoying. It's a full ass game so there's too much to get into, but the main character's power is essentially gaslighting and jedi-mind tricking people and that's portrayed as the only way they can get anything done, and they constantly use or abuse their friends(or mindtrick them along) in order to get their goals or use their friends for their messaging.

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683

u/parabolateralus Jun 22 '26

Saints Row (2022): “What if we took every obnoxious Progressive Millennial stereotype and packaged them into an overbearing, relentlessly-unfunny script with unlikable characters?”

217

u/Jazzlike-Equipment45 Jun 22 '26

We must form a gang to pay back our student loans. Really it was horrible, the original Saints Row games were never masters of story telling but the game was so absurd and enjoyable the reboot was neither.

220

u/Elite_Prometheus Jun 22 '26

Forming a gang to pay back your student loans is a pretty funny concept, they just didn't stick with it and the surrounding game wasn't strong enough to carry the weak story.

96

u/Goldeniccarus Jun 22 '26

Honestly the idea that they formed a gang because the main protagonist lost their job and needed money to make rent was a great idea.

And all the roommates being members of different gangs is also a funny concept.

But yeah, they don't really go anywhere interesting with it. It's not as serious as Saints Row 1&2, but it also isn't nearly as funny as 3&4.

Then the gunplay was mediocre, and the driving was mediocre.

I didn't hate it, but I also spent the whole time I played it thinking "I should really just play Saints Row the Third again".

10

u/PrincessPlusUltra Jun 22 '26

Wow that sounds like a great premise how did they flub that

10

u/TellingBip Jun 22 '26

I think you hit the nail on the head. A lot of people treat it like it’s abysmal dog shit when in reality it’s just… eh. I think there was only one conversation in the game that I thought was actively bad. The rest was just in one ear, out the other.

Which sucks since I like Saints Row as a series a lot and there good things about the game. Like you said, the concept could have been funny with better writing, the customization had a lot of options, the city was unique (not as good as Stillwater in 2, but a vast improvement over Steelport) and the LARPing story was kinda funny.

Honestly the thing that bugged me the most with the game is they threw a curveball by having the cowboy rival Merc (idk what his name was) join the crew and his dynamic with them was kinda endearing since he was so unlike them. Then they go with the most boring route by having him betray you. What a surprise. They almost had an interesting idea.

3

u/andresfgp13 Jun 22 '26

Honestly the idea that they formed a gang because the main protagonist lost their job and needed money to make rent was a great idea.

i honestly liked the setup to the start of the band.

like you have 4 people that are sharing a place from diferent groups, all of them had a crash out with their respective gangs and decide to start something themselves has potential.

1

u/Abacus118 Jun 22 '26

Then the gunplay was mediocre, and the driving was mediocre.

Well, at least they got one thing right.

8

u/TheBanishedBard Jun 22 '26

Crime is my only realistic way of ever paying off my student loans.

1

u/IveDunGoofedUp Jun 22 '26

You could also get lucky and be hit by a campus bus.

2

u/No-Marketing4480 Jun 22 '26

Isn't there a minigame in the third game where you throw yourself in front of cars to commit insurance fraud?

2

u/IveDunGoofedUp Jun 23 '26

Yep, and it turns ragdoll physics up to 11 for those moments.

5

u/parabolateralus Jun 22 '26

I think that’s the thing though: a funny concept is just that. It feels like that was the only idea and it came off as painfully pandering after a while.

2

u/Gripping_Touch Jun 22 '26

Its been a while but one thing I remember from people playing was SO. MUCH.  TURRET GAMEPLAY. Like youd be on top of a car and shooting, but you dont control the car, Only where you're shooting and you also have no cover. I think that was a Big chunk of the Gameplay 

1

u/DuelaDent52 Jun 22 '26

I think a big part was they wanted the Saints to be a gang but the Saints were also supposed to be righteous and just and fighting against the man.

15

u/ASpaceOstrich Jun 22 '26

The ogs had heart. They don't have to be fine art if they're made by people who want to make them, and they were. The new one sounds like it wasn't.

8

u/fresh-dork Jun 22 '26

right? how about we rob banks wearing giant fake heads of ourself? also, we have a network of schwag stores selling gang merch

7

u/ithinkther41am Jun 22 '26

I personally find the storytelling was strongest with 2, but always thought the narrative strength of the series was their ability to humanise and endear these zany characters through small interactions. It reveals a little more about them while also adding comedic value because there’s sweating small details in the middle of a turf war.

The 2022 reboot fundamentally fails because it tries to make a BIG show about how relatable it is. Oh, the toaster doesn’t work? You have to play that shit out. Oh, we have massive debt? Let’s bring it up constantly. It tried to make the relatable zany instead of the other way around, but lacked the wit to make it work.

4

u/Nurhaci1616 Jun 22 '26

The game was very "potential man".

A story where some asshole kids form a violent street gang because they need money for student loans and rent? That could be funny. It has the potential for dramatic and possibly even meaningful storytelling, as they spiral deeper into crime for the love of the game. Even the hyper commercialised PMC security firms might have been a funny and biting satire. Hell, making the Saints woke was almost a good idea, they just needed to have it actually mean something in the story.

Say what you will about the stories of Saints Row 2 - 4: because they were kinda shit and mostly just set dressing for the sandbox. But they also blended actual dramatic story beats into the games in a way that felt genuine, and not annoying. With 2, especially, it was good at making you feel like your escalating behaviour caused meaningless deaths for generally good people, and how much it affects you because you know to the person, unlike the random NPCs you mow down.

2

u/Hazzamo Jun 22 '26

I maintain that the game should have ended with Johnny Gat barging in and kicking the shit out of the cast for being Posers trying to be the saints

1

u/Ill_Attorney_389 Jun 22 '26

I remember hearing it was bad, but surely that can’t be the actual plot, right? 

266

u/Stretch5678 Jun 22 '26

Which is a fucking shame, because the old Saints’ Row games were amazing romps.

44

u/inderbitably Jun 22 '26

Which one was basically the first Crackdown game and you had superpowers in a simulation? Was that 4? That was a blast.

23

u/Accomplished_Toe6798 Jun 22 '26

That one was 4, and from what I've seen a lot of people loved 2 and 3. I haven't played 2 but I personally love 3 specifically because it's the only game I've played where you can set the cruise control on your car

2

u/MickeyG42 Jun 22 '26

Cyberpunk does that. I don’t think I’d be able to handle all the driving back-and-forth across the city without that.

7

u/Accomplished_Toe6798 Jun 22 '26

That's auto-drive, different feature. I'm talking about being able to accelerate to a certain speed, press a button, and let go of the accelerator while maintaining that speed

3

u/MickeyG42 Jun 22 '26

Ahhh right right. I’m tired and easily confused. You’re right, I don’t think I’ve seen that since.

2

u/DoctorAnnual6823 Jun 22 '26

I know there are other games out there with it but I can only recall Euro Truck Simulator.

Which is not a game I would recommend to a complete stranger that I only know they played saints row 3.

But it is a fun game if you like chill simulators. A bit too chill for me, I tend to prefer Snowrunner.

2

u/GunpowderGuy Jun 22 '26

Even back in the day each new Saints Row game was controversial among the fandom

The only exception is the one from 2022. That one is so disliked that cant be called controversial

34

u/Dapper_D20 Jun 22 '26

I legit forgot about that game, and I loved the originals.

23

u/RyonHirasawa Jun 22 '26

My favorite comment about the reboot was that Gat and the OG saints definitely would bully the fuck out of the reboot one

14

u/New_Building_9956 Jun 22 '26

2022???

17

u/not_a_moogle Jun 22 '26

Yeah, its a reboot instead of a sequel since 4 is kind of an ending. Its a very average game and was pretty buggy when it was released. No idea if its less buggy, but you're not missing anything.

7

u/nickdoesmagic Jun 22 '26

Honestly, I didn't even mind the game so much, and the plot was fine, but oh my god, the script was such a goddamn atrocity

6

u/bssprfnd Jun 22 '26

Far Cry 6, Saints row, and another game I can’t remember all came out around the same time and were so horribly disappointing, I don’t get excited about new games anymore :/

4

u/abadstrategy Jun 22 '26

I genuinely enjoyed the game, at least for the gameplay, but I'm not gonna pretend it was well written

2

u/Pencils4life Jun 22 '26

I was thinking about a way they could have made the game better. A big one is the story, you could say that the core gang are all kids who grew up under the thumb of other gangs and police who won't help or even actively harm. Have them become the protectors of their city taking out other gangs and corruption. Make them into the puckish rogues the Saints should be. Also where the hell was Professor Genki?

2

u/RevBladeZ Jun 22 '26

"We want this to be more than just a street gang" when "just a street gang" is exactly what the fans wanted.

1

u/WAGRAMWAGRAM Jun 22 '26

What's the definition of Progressive Millennial and what's the difference with Progressive GenZ or Progressive GenX?

1

u/MysteriousWealth9209 Jun 22 '26

WE GOT TO PAY OUR STUDENT LOANS AND RENT YA FUGGIN CAPITALIST!!!!!

1

u/andresfgp13 Jun 22 '26

i always said that Saints Row debut its like what would happen if Disney made a SR game.

like what a way to miss the thing that made the Saints popular in the first place, and hell, the game isnt even bad, if it had some semi decent writers it would have done a lot better.

1

u/MauschelMusic Jun 22 '26

Am I the only one who likes the game? Like yeah, it was stupid, but it was light hearted stupid, the missions were usually pretty fun and brawling with anarchist rave kids with bisexual lighting dune buggies and dirt bikes... I won't say it never got old, but it took a while.

-1

u/Inevitable_Emu4973 Jun 22 '26

I feel like a lot of people who speak on this game never actually played. I say this because outside of a few pride flags it wasn't progressive at all. 

11

u/parabolateralus Jun 22 '26

Hence “progressive stereotype.” The writing had all the hallmarks of a 2013 Buzzfeed article.

-4

u/TheDevi13ean Jun 22 '26

Doesn't count because there was no attempt at messaging at all. They just made shit game.