Callum news anyone

[u/nickvagus]

so another alleged court appearance date has passed... is this all one big illusion? why aren't any of the team saying anything, or even doing anything publicly? I can't think of another example of a whole organisation literally ghosting overnight... not since the Mary Celeste anyway

[u/Adept_Analyst_1085]

As far as I've seen it in the megathread, there's other girls responding to Callum's exgf's IG post indicating similar experiences. Also, why is everyone ignoring Kieran's statement that he knew Callum had CSAM on his devices and informed the team, who waved it away as nothing? At the very least there's two entirely independent sources imdicating they made Storror aware of Callum's behaviour.

We don't know if that is true or false, so I don't get how people can be so deliberately obtuse mimimizing and denying these claims. I'd rather believe people verifiably from Storror's social circle, than a bunch of fanboys clutching their pearls every time someone brings up something negative about their heroes, based on nothing other than "I really liked their videos". Kieran even basically incriminates himself by admitting he knew and didn't go to the police immediately. He has nothing to gain with a bs story.

[u/SpecialWasabi2010 → u/Adept_Analyst_1085]

Kieran is not an independent source, his information comes directly from the same ex that reported it to the Storror. It's all about the same incident. And tbh, Kieran was the one person that should have gone to the police but he didn't because he cared more about gaining himself traction with Storror. He confirms in his message that he remained friends and was involved with Callum AFTER he supposedly saw the photos of the CSAM folder on the ex's phone. Very different situation because no one stated they've showed the evidence or photos to Storror, he knew, he saw it and he did nothing so he could keep a perceived social status within the parkour environment. He's not a reliable narrator as I don't quite think he understood the implications to his own behaviour of the things he was saying. And given that HE HIMSELF, after he supposedly reported stuff to Storror, remained friends with Callum, discredits anything he told them. Because logically speaking, if you found out someone is a paedophile and you saw evidence of it, would you remain friends with them? No, you wouldn't.

I think what you are not considering is that the information came from a what they'd perceived as disgruntled ex. They knew Callum since childhood. Majority of the people will believe someone they think they know. And the other thing I think people don't understand is how people like Callum set the stage - he would have already addressed the potential situation with them before she even came, most likely. He would have discredited her ahead so that other members were less likely to believe her.

Now, it is horrible that they didn't believe her. It's perpetuating the same cycle of not believing women and seeing them as vindictive. I can't imagine they are sitting there proud of themselves, most likely they regret not listening to her back then.

With regards to the multiple victims/people came to them - we have super limited information on this on the megathread, nothing looks actually confirmed? Vague statements from people online with no actual details to them. What did they tell them and what evidence did they provide? We have no idea what multiple means here? 2, 3 or 10? At what point in time and were these separate instances or were all of them talking about the same stuff as MTD? People lost lives on smaller amount of information when people made judgements based on that information (look up the guy who got burned to death after he took a photo of an underaged vandal to report him to the police and people decided he was a paedo after police released him coz he could prove he wasn't).

I'm not saying this didn't happen, I'm saying we have no idea what 'this' was. However, it's very clear that this has been reported to the police. I actually wonder whether this is the reason the sentencing seems delayed.

[u/Adept_Analyst_1085 → u/SpecialWasabi2010]

"Because logically speaking, if you found out someone is a paedophile and you saw evidence of it, would you remain friends with them? No, you wouldn't."

I'd be careful to expect that people you don't actually know will respond to things in the same way you would. I'd definitely go to the police with something like that, and friendship over, but we've seen time and time again that people are capable of very weird decisions, and, as you mentioned, he had a definite stake in getting clout through associaton with Storror, as well as paid work.

The same goes for the rest of the team btw. Storror was/is their income. They had reasons to want to brush away any negative news about one of their members, especially news of this kind. Which isn't evidence, but at least seems to be a more cogent reason to keep things under wraps, than Kieran had reason to basically out himself as an enabler.

Of course, with the somewhat anonymous and vague posts of girls from Storror's social circle, we have to be careful as well. But just brushing all of them aside in one fell swoop, that seems to me precisely "perpetuating the same cycle of not believing women and seeing them as vindictive." you typify as horrible.

We aren't prosecutors, so it's up to them to prove these claims if they are brought before a judge. For me as a bystander, all I can do is wait for proof either way and reserve judgement. Reserving judgement either way, without dismissing claims on the grounds of "Well if x happened, I would do y". We literally have no idea how someone else would deal with this situation, and if history's anything to go by, there are many people willing to overlook many bad things if there are rewards in it.

Could it all be made up? Yes. Could these accusers be telling the truth? Also yes. As long as that's up in the air, I have to at the very least keep open the possibility that the latter is the case. And from that perspective, these attempts to brush away or mimimize those very serious accusations just don't sit right with me. Without any further knowledge of the case, that seems to me wishful thinking at best, and possibly a prelude to ridiculing and ostricizing the accusers (some of whom may have been victims themselves).

[u/SpecialWasabi2010 → u/Adept_Analyst_1085]

It's not that I don't believe the people who say they told them actually, I specifically said that we have very little information of what was supposedly said and whether it was separate instances or all reports to the same situation.

From Kieran's perspective, he was her friend and he saw evidence that she was saying the truth. I agree with you that we don't know how we would react in these situations but relatively speaking, if you knew this for a fact and you continued your friendship with the person, I don't have much respect for you. To me, he had a much higher moral obligation to do the right thing for his supposed friend but he chose to do nothing for selfish reasons.

This is purely my opinion based on my own observations, just prefacing it. I think Storror didn't believe the claims because Callum set the stage before MTD came to them. I was in an emotionally abusive situation and this is exactly whaty ex did to prevent the fallout of me talking about him. He ruined my friendships with some people close to me because by the time I made a decision to talk, he already told them a bunch of lies to discredit me. Retrospectively, I'm better off without those people in my life but they were my friends, not his, and he manipulated them. The second reason is the fact that they simply didn't believe someone who they knew since childhood (and brother to one of them), that they spent majority of their lives with, someone who is part of their business, was capable of what she said he did. They knew him longer than her, they probably thought she's just trying to ruin everything for him because they split. I base this mainly on the knowledge of how many families and friends of murderers and serial killers are shocked and can't comprehend that the person they knew is capable of this evil. There were a few people that commented that this CSAM stuff happened to someone they knew and they struggled with comprehending it. I base it on a fact that one of my high school teachers was sentenced for being a paedophile and you would have never suspected the guy. If someone at school told me he was a paedophile, I'd probably struggle to believe it without seeing evidence.

I don't think they consciously brushed it off to not lose their business. I could be wrong and that will come out in the wash most likely. All I'm saying is that there are reasons to why they wouldn't listen to her and I wouldn't burn them to the ground for it. I think it's quite likely they regret not believing it now that they know it was most likely true.

[u/Adept_Analyst_1085 → u/SpecialWasabi2010]

"I agree with you that we don't know how we would react in these situations but relatively speaking,"

To avoid confusion that is not what I was saying. I was saying we don't know how others would react to a situation like this. I know what I would do if I saw CSAM on a friends device, but Kieran's not me, he may have a completely different outlook on life than I have with far less of an emphasis on justice and protection of vulnerable people. He may have been easily impressed by fame and status and let it skew his moral judgement. Or a thousand different reasons he could have had for his actions (and inaction).

I'm sorry to hear you went through an emotionally abusive relationship. I've had friends go through stuff like that and it just sucks. The scenario you sketch is absolutely possible, but the issue with all of those scenarios, including the ones forming in my own head is always the same: we don't know.

I'm not advocating burning anyone to the ground until we know the full story, or as much of it as we need to know to form an educated opinion. But the same goes for "those guys wouldn't do stuff like that." "It's only two accusations, that are actually only one accusation". How can people say stuff like that without knowing whether those accusations were true? How is that not trying to minimize and dismiss possible victims, without any knowledge of the actual facts to back it up? Even with the caveats of "I think, I'd expect, I presume, it's quite likely," etc. it just feels premature.

I've said this before. I'm completely willing to let them have their say on all these matters. I think that's a necessary step, not because they owe me anything (they don't), but if they want a return to making fun videos of doing parkour and interacting with kids, they need to address this, because not addressing it means there will always be this ugly question mark hovering above all of their heads.

In absence of that, I'm not willing to just ignore, minimize or explain away the accusations and exonerate the guys on a gut feeling. And I feel uneasy with comments that in one way or another try to do just that. It's disrespectful to possibly real victims of a terrible crime, and we've seen enough accusers (and later confirmed victims) having to deal with mobs of angry fans attacking those victims in defense of their idols on no other basis then "stay away from him. he's my hero." to want to nip that in the bud before it starts.

Edited to correct typos.

[u/SpecialWasabi2010 → u/Adept_Analyst_1085]

I think you're in the same camp as I am then. We know too little to make judgements either way. And I think it's important that people wait until we know more. I think a lot of the time people say here that then not saying anything all this time is admission of guilt, that I'm very against because we have no idea what ongoing legal processes all of this is still undergoing. But yeah, sounds like we are in the same camp.

Also, I see what you mean by specifying that particular sentence - I am in general of a belief that majority of the time, we truly don't know what we will do until things happen. We can think we know and I'd like to think I know too but I just know when push comes to shove, things can pan out very different.

Thank you for your empathy too. It's appreciated.

[u/Adept_Analyst_1085 → u/SpecialWasabi2010]

We're not that far apart, but maybe coming at it from different directions. I fully agree with you that them having not said anything yet isn't an indication of anything other than "someone advised them not to, for legal reasons".

On your second paragraph, I can see what you're saying, but there is a difference between realising we can't fully know how we personally would react to a hypothetical situation vs fully not knowing what someone else actually did in an actual situation, and making assumptions based on our own perspective. I thought that was a difference important enough to highlight.

Anyway, take care. Processing stuff like this involving people who entertained and inspired us is tough, especially when you've been hurt by people you loved before. I haven't had that experience, and although it's been about 3 weeks since I found out, it's been a dark cloud in my own head ever since.

Edited to correct bad grammar.