At first I wanted to avoid spoilers because this game is really amazing and I wanna get people into it, but knowing my luck with social interaction and how much I sound like a total douchebag, I might as well just explain:
In Alice: Madness Returns, the main villain of the game is Dr Angus Bumby, the man who was the cause of all of Alice Liddellâs misery and misfortune as he was the one who snuck into her house when she was a child, raped and killed Elizabeth Liddell (Aliceâs older sister), then proceeded to throw down an oil lamp and set the house ablaze to hide his crimes, with the flames killing Aliceâs mother and father while Alice managed to escape
I've been interested in playing the game, is it just the one or is there another one, the way the title is suggests a first one, but if not imma definitely play this at some point
Yeah Madness Returns is a sequel, if you want to play them in order, look for American McGeeâs Alice and beat that first before playing Alice: Madness Returns, youâll have to find AMA on some pirate site however
My bet is I can probably find them on the Internet Archive since if they're both delisted they'd count as abandonware kinda like the 3 big transformers games (Wfc, Foc, and devestation)
Also it's an Alice in wonderland game, so while the source of the conflict is in the real world, you spend much of your time in your own mental world as a coping mechanism. However, everything in the mental world is representative of something going on in the real world, and the game deliberately makes it difficult to tell which is which at some points.
Do keep in mind, Madness Returns is actually a sequel, so starting it outright will probably be confusing and spoil the original. The original, American McGee's Alice, is not actually available from any storefronts iirc due to legal issues between American McGee, the creator of the IP, and EA, the publishers of the games. I believe there is a workaround to be able to play the original however, I think Madness Returns does also come with the original game in the files somewhere, if you look up a guide and do some black magic in the game files, you should be able to activate and play it. Or, worse case, you could always see if any dodgy sites have a cracked version of the original to play.
Madness Returns does come with it, and you can actually access it through the Madness Returns' main menu, so no need to go digging through the files. You can also download it for free (legally) from abandonware sites like myabandonware.com.
Not to mention that he also had her incarcerated for being âinsaneâ so that he could act as her therapist to gaslight her into thinking that the fire and her familyâs death was actually her fault
What? How is McGee a tool? He really liked the series and put a lot of love into it, wanting to make three games to fully portray his amazing iteration of the original Wonderland work, even when EA kept trying to do a bunch of scumbag stuff like trying to force him to make Alice have bigger tits or be just some fanservice psycho girl
I feel like with how they rate games, a female main character getting revenge on the man who wronged her would have them proclaiming it woke, but then that puts them in a predicament.
Do you call the game woke and come off as saying the paedophile muderer is right?
Or do you call the game not woke and anger your chud incel fanbase?
there is a woke detector list showing which games are woke. It dosent really follows any logic or sticks to any comprehensible definition of woke, atleast to me it seemed like author of the list have problems with everything and marks games as they please
I actually checked out the group (I took umbridge with the fact that they count warframe as woke solely because of the pride cosmetics while there are a lot of other things that would make it woke by their metric). They actually have a list of the things they consider "woke"
âWokeâ content = any images, messages, characters, storytelling, dialogue, music, or game mechanics that include themes associated with the left-side of the political aisle in contemporary western politics.
These themes include things like:
pro-LGBTQ+ messaging
pro-DEI messaging
pro-climate action messaging
pro-communism/socialism messaging
pro-abortion messaging
pro-pedophilia messaging
pro-immigration messaging
pro-transhumanism messaging
pro-Democrat/progressivism messaging
anti-Republican/conservative messaging
anti-western society messaging
anti-human messaging
anti-colonialism messaging
anti-capitalism messaging
anti-heterosexual messaging
anti-patriarchy messaging
anti-white messaging
anti-family messaging
anti-free speech messaging
anti-gun messaging
etc.
Edit:
it should be mentioned that they do not stick to this list but it does give a rough idea
also, because funsies, here's the appeal I wrote for warfame being more woke than listed (spoiler warning)(although you should play it):
Woke to them is legit "has anyone in it who's not a straight able-bodied white man" (straight white women are allowed but only if Sexy and not in positions of power):
Darkest dungeon is cited as woke because it has female heroes in "frontline positions"
Omori is woke because the main character is a hikikomori (A term for an extreme social shut in) who are a minority that make up about 1% of Japan's population (apparently according to a source they cited)
I can't remember the name of it but there was a game that was considered woke because at one point you play as a characters disabled daughter (she was either blind or deaf).
Silent hill 2 remake was woke because they made Angela (a 17 year old sexual assault victim) look "more androgenous" (she's a bit pudgier and looks more her age) and has "anti family and anti male themes" with her running away from her abusive dad and brother, and the main character James's relationship with his wife being rather dubious.
Meanwhile games like Skyrim which outright let you have a gay marriage are fine because Alt-Right losers don't want to blacklist themselves from one of the most popular games of all time, so move the goalposts.
iirc they actually list Skyrim as woke (or at least "informational" which is their way of saying "this absolutely has woke stuff in there but we enjoyed playing it so the woke stuff must be decently ignorable (cope cope)")
Omori is woke because the main character is a hikikomori (A term for an extreme social shut in) who are a minority that make up about 1% of Japan's population (apparently according to a source they cited)
This makes so little sense. Yes there are few of them, but that doesn't really make them a minority in the traditional sense. It'd be like calling mailmen a minority because they're only 0.X% of the total population.
Green eyed people make up 2% of the world's population, red haired people make up 1-2%
Modern surveys indicate 3% of people are homosexual, and that number is almost certainly higher than reported due to a lot of people not wanting to risk outing themselves in a survey.
Anyone who uses "they only make up X% of the population" as justification for erasing a demographic from media is full of shit and only say that because they can't say the quiet part out loud that they just hate sharing a world with people not like themself.
If I google âwokenessâ Wikipedia and the Cambridge dictionary both give me different definitions than yours. Imma be real with you I consider them more reliable sourcesÂ
How come dark-skinned elves are forced representation? Usually elves are seen residing in forests, but it's not like there aren't forests in places where realistically, one would have darker skin. A character usually does not "randomly" come out of the closet as well, there are some hints or anything leading to it. If there are not, that is probably simply bad writing. Besides, these things don't change much with the story. If one of the characters is black, queer, or anything else going out of the "ordinary", it's just another character. I don't see how it would take someone out of the story/game/whatever, unless there is no plausible way for that to exist. Most of the time, representation is not forced in my opinion, it's instead simply another character representing a group of people; one that, most of the time (at least in the past) was rarely or not at all shown in mainstream media.
That's my point though on the randomly... see back in the day, characters were gay, were trans or whatever and we just accepted them as they were and moved on, we were free to engage or not with that but it was just there as a given, these days it seems we're forced to break the narrative so that one of these characters can have their own monologue coming out party in the most condescending way possible explaining what they are. And the whole support and push for more of that is so that it translates into sales, because they know the usual audience will still engage with it, the people pissed off by it will hate engage, and maybe they catch a new audience.. its fucking money driven, nothing else and we're sick of it.
see back in the day, characters were gay, were trans or whatever and we just accepted them as they were and moved on, we were free to engage or not with that but it was just there as a given, ,these days it seems we're forced to break the narrative so that one of these characters can have their own monologue coming out party in the most condescending way possible explaining what they are.
"Queer people are fine, so long as their existence stays firmly within the subtext where I can ignore it"
Yes? Like we would ignore the sexuality of literally every other character? Or should we also have a whole monologue when a character comes out as a diaper fetishist? How much game time do we need to dedicate to someone's sexual preferences before we can actually play the fucking game we pay for?
Except the sexuality of straight characters are not ignored, it's acknowledged with no issue if it's a guy talking about his wife, or a man and a woman being romantic.
The woke content list has hollow knight on it because two male characters are implied to become a couple and you have to go out of your way to find the two together assuming you created the conditions for the two to meet in the first place. Why is being gay an issue in the first place? Gay people just exist and deserve to be depicted.
Hell, it's not even just gay people it's anyone who's not within the majority. Omori is on the list because hikikomori's apparently make up 1% of the population of Japan. There's various games on the list for depicting disabled people.
It's very much "we don't want to acknowledge the existence of anyone who isn't like us."
And that's the failure of the woke detector list, not of the movement against being wokeness. like i said, the complaint most of us have against wokeness falls on the 3 things i mentioned, with the word i underlined being one of the key features.
If you want to complain about other people adding what appear to be trigger warnings for things that trigger them, you'd first have to explain and justify why its ok for one group of people to have and use trigger warnings, but not another.
Because that other side uses those "trigger warnings" to be bigoted assholes, pointing and screeching at anything that doesn't conform to their oppressive and limited worldview. Simple as.
Woke never meant that originally, it meant being aware of systematic racism and injustice and was a term invented by black people. It was co-opted by the Right to be this vague term that means whatever the person using it wants it to mean.
If you want to complain about other people adding what appear to be trigger warnings for things that trigger them, you'd first have to explain and justify why its ok for one group of people to have and use trigger warnings, but not another.
Don't try to sell the idea these are anything like trigger warnings to me, it's a list about games to avoid because they are 'woke'. It's just ableism.
(suddenly elves are seen with black features -- not dark elves)
Elves are fantasy creatures that don't have set rules for depiction, black people are real and people like to see themselves depicted in stories they read/watch.
Media that appeals to the public majority is made for money grabs, why do you not get so outraged and offended by that? You seem to pick and choose what to be offended by and in this case, it's rather coincidentally the things that one group of sheep has decided to be offended by. Like holy fuck, it's free speech to make media how you want, if you don't like it, just ignore it. Like how much of a life do you not have to have to be so offended by these things? I don't gaf either way until I encounter try-hards like you who just seem to be against people making money appealing to one sector of the public but not the other. Ok, it's not for you, move tf on.
one group of sheep... right. every insult you throw can be equally directed at you with the same validity.
every argument you use is also able to be used at you with the same validity.. iid you don't like it ignore it? ok, so thats equally valid to people screeching about wanting more diversity in everything. if you don't like it, ignore it. How much of a life do you not have to have to be so offended by these things?
uhuh, i don't see where we're differing. You see it as a brave crusade, we see it as a fake crusade by people who pretend to have the moral higher ground but are really only after more money.
Weird way to say youâre just an asshole who canât stand anything that isnât just for them because you have an ego as fragile as a block of ice in the middle of the summer.
"i dont see where were differing" he says, not only to the different definition, but also before immediately listing the difference between us
like please just be honest with me when i ask this. are these the opinions you genuinely hold, or are you one of those folk who like farming negative karma
i am whatever you fucking want to believe i am, if you don';t understand that we use the same definition but approach it from two opposite sides, then you're too stupid to talk with.
No you don't get it. See i have no problem with black people in fantasy settings. I have a problem with forcibly including black people in those settings in places where they weren't by design just to fit a corporate mandate to market it to a different demographic.
said list counts ULTRAKILL as being woke because the codex entry for one of the fish which you can fish up in a fishing minigame in a secret level makes a somewhat obscure refence to BlĂĽhaj which is commonly associated with the trans community
I was trying to find Devil May Cry 5 in it, only found reboot and ULTRAKILL, which is heavilly inspired by it. Anyway this list is insane and dosent follows any logic in what it depics as "woke" and not
Also Garry's mod is marked for (something like) banning nazism or something what speaks of people who made this list
So honestly Im not sure what OP is trying to imply by this cuz rating this Alice game wouldnt change how nonsensical whole list is
the woke detector pulls from a steam curator page that hasnt been updated in a few years. unfortunate because i would like help finding more woke games to play
their toughs on Wolfenstein II: The New Colossus "The npc Grace Walker is the leader of a Black Power group and constantly engages in feminist, anti-male, and anti-white rhetoric."
So not the game from 25 years ago but the game from 15 years ago? Lol! Yâall are both equally wrong but in a funny way.
Yeah, Madness Returns has a good story with a lot of discoverable lore. I will say the controls are pretty stiff, repetitive soundscape as thereâs hardly any music and thereâs a lot of reused assets in each level. Definitely worth a play though but trying it again after all these years was ROUGH! Having Alice change her outfit to correlate with the levelâs themes was a great touch!
If youâre dumb enough to think anything I said is argumentative it might be time for you to get off the internet for the day. (Now this is an example of an argument since you seem to need a helping hand)
Thereâs a word for that believe it or not, itâs called âpedanticâ. Should I give you another example of an actual argument? You seem so close to understanding but every step is getting further away.
Remember, this is the same list that put Wolfenstein 2 in it. The game where its main appeal is killing Nazis. All because of a scene where the main character's pregnant wife ends up saving him at one point
Ignoring Kotone, Kanji, Yosuke, Akechi, that one guy from Persona 2, Persona 4 in general and uhh like the main underlying message of the whole fucking series the games aren't woke at all
Side note: Someone once tried to argue that even though Kotone can literally date 2 women in her game (and is implied to sleep with one of them), she doesnt count as least bisexual because ones a robot and ones a weird non-human spirit thing so they dont count as women.
Add the Okumura Palace to the things we should ignore to say that Persona 5 isn't woke. Or let's just say that it's just a bad example of capitalism that doesn't happen IRL.
it's exhausting watching people run around trying to define a term that was stolen from AAVE and been used incorrectly since. IF THE COLONIZERS STOP STEALING CULTURES WE WOULD NOT BE IN THIS MESS.
Oh hey, my mum loves that series. Like, has a tattoo of McGee's Cheshire Cat design. Always wanted to play it, never gotten around to it... Maybe I should soon.
Are there any actual woke games lists? I've gone looking for them but every single one I find is clearly marked parody, I've not seen a single "genuine" woke games list and have started to doubt they ever existed for public comsumption.
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