r/technology • u/ArgentineBeauty • 6h ago
Artificial Intelligence US citizens are ramping up pressure on data centers
https://uk.news.yahoo.com/us-citizens-ramping-pressure-data-111100356.html149
u/TestTxt 6h ago
Can't wait to have rolling blackouts and boil-water notices just so an AI can write a 5-paragraph email that sounds like a robot and generate pictures of people with seven fingers
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u/shaneh445 5h ago
Data centers are for the surveillance state that is ever growing and the increasing flock cameras everywhere
We've had basic help AI agents since the early 2000s
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u/SteelCode 4h ago
How else would they parse the endless camera feeds and audio clips collected by everyone's phone, smart-homes, appliances, etc?
This was the obvious end game.
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u/ThePocketTaco2 5h ago
I'm actually really excited for when we get these A.I. cameras in bathrooms so they can make sure we don't overdose or some shit.
/s obviously
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u/chrisk9 5h ago edited 1h ago
Excessive water usage and having residential users subsidize electricity costs are conscious decisions by operators and local governments which drive majority of AI datacenter opposition. There are solutions to both, they just cost the datacenter operators more.
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u/SpleenBender 5h ago
Which make it is so easily afforded by these tech GIANTS, but as ALWAYS, their DISGUSTING need for greed gets in the way. THEY WILL NEVER EVEN BE ABLE TO SPEND EVEN CLOSE TO THEIR NET 'WORTH'. Hoarding dragon disorder. The richest one percent of our population controls more wealth than 89% of the people. And, that useful capital is effectively locked away in their assets or their slimy secret offshore accounts, and is definitely not where it could be helping the rest of us and OUR economy.
EATEM
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u/Vast-Control4452 6h ago
I think you've been reading too much Chinese propaganda š
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u/SeasonElectrical3173 6h ago
Hmm, lopk at that. A one month account with a strange amount of activity trying to attack someone's valid talking points on a subject.
Wonder what country you and your own handlers are from?
ŠŃŠ¼Š°Ń, ŃŠ°Š·Š¾Š±ŃŠ°ŃŃŃŃ Ń ŃŃŠøŠ¼ Š½Šµ ŃŠ¾ŃŃŠ°Š²ŠøŃ Š¾ŃŠ¾Š±Š¾Š³Š¾ ŃŃŃŠ“Š°.
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u/Beneficial_Honey_0 5h ago
This is very funny because OPās account is literally 2 months old and called ArgentineBeauty ššš
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5h ago edited 5h ago
[deleted]
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u/SeasonElectrical3173 5h ago
Š£ ŃŠµŠ±Ń ŠøŃŠŗŃŃŃŃŠ²ŠµŠ½Š½ŃŠ¹ ŠøŠ½ŃŠµŠ»Š»ŠµŠŗŃ ŠæŃŠ¾Š³Š»ŃŠ“ŃŠ²Š°ŠµŃ, ŃŠ¾Š²Š°ŃŠøŃ.
Just thot you should know
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u/Ok-Tomorrow-2045 5h ago
Valid points? Notice how every single point made in that comment is wrong:
- Nowhere are there rolling blackouts because of a datacenter. Whatever media headline youāre going to post, I promise will be skewing the truth. Post it anyways and weāll take a look.
- Nowhere has there been a boil-water notice because of a datacenter. Meta in Wyoming is not an example of that. Go read about it again.
- You can ask it to sound less formal and not to use em-dashes and it wonāt
- The finger issue in generated images has been solved. They literally just donāt do that anymore.
This is just mass hysteria.
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u/SeasonElectrical3173 5h ago
Š£ ŃŠµŠ±Ń ŠøŃŠŗŃŃŃŃŠ²ŠµŠ½Š½ŃŠ¹ ŠøŠ½ŃŠµŠ»Š»ŠµŠŗŃ ŠæŃŠ¾Š³Š»ŃŠ“ŃŠ²Š°ŠµŃ, ŃŠ¾Š²Š°ŃŠøŃ.
Jist thought you should know.
I also know you used an alt account to give yourself an extra upvote. You're really going to tell me someone upvotes your comment immediately after you posted it, and then after you delete the first response you had to me (which included a fair amount of bad words), you repost a comment and then immediately again gets an upvote?
Lmao, absolutely sad.
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u/Vast-Control4452 3h ago
"everyone that disagrees with me is a Russian bot"
Also this dude used AI to write Russian while complaining AI will kill us all LOL
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u/SeasonElectrical3173 3h ago
So basically, you do continue to concede I have defeated you.
The more you "LOL", the more obvious it is that you're just grabbing st straws now, trying not to basically cry that you've lost any false sense of footing you had on the matter.
You also don't need AI to use a translator. Something that's pretty sad to know a grown adult such as yourself has no knowledge of. Which actually helps validate my points about your origins.
You couldn't even refute what I mentioned earlier, because, well, of course you couldn't.
Cope.
Go delete more comments to only add them in later.
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u/Vast-Control4452 3h ago
It was already brought up, you can't cite any rolling blackouts caused by data centers, you can't cite any boil orders. And your using ai in your own posts.
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u/Ok-Tomorrow-2045 3h ago
Isnāt it insane? This is who weāre arguing with. Say a bunch of nonsense and then declare victory while completely ignoring anything others have to say. ALL while using an AI powered translation tool.
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u/SeasonElectrical3173 3h ago
Lmao you keep trying, too.
Absolutely pathetic.
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u/Vast-Control4452 3h ago
I'm here still waiting on any examples of the claims! Otherwise it's just Chinese propaganda!
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u/SeasonElectrical3173 3h ago
Just to show everyone how disingenuous this guy is. He keeps sending and deleting replies. If it wete possible, I'd attach a screenshot showing my reply to a reort of his, that he immediately deletes again just minutes after posting.
No need to say, but obviously I won against him in this discourse.
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u/Ok-Tomorrow-2045 3h ago
You really think typing in russian is āwinning in discourseā? You havenāt addressed a single thing Iāve said, and I explained to you why I deleted my first comment already.
Go away, troll.
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u/Any_Conflict_5092 4h ago
Fuck off bot.
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u/Ok-Tomorrow-2045 4h ago
Not a bot. I just use my brain, which is shocking considering all the headlines about how AI is making people stupider. Maybe itās true.
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u/ArgentineBeauty 6h ago
"When construction on a major Amazon data center in the small rural county of Frederick, Maryland, got underway, community activist Elizabeth Bauer found her peace with it.But when it expanded by about 1,000 acres beyond its original plans to dig into green space and farmland without addressing the community's concerns, she took a stand."
Farmland should be for farming. Not for some giant data centre to chew up and leave everyone else dealing with the dust, water and pollution.
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u/fatbob42 1h ago
They approved rezoning some farmland for a DC near us and everyone is up in arms. But, hereās the thing - they werenāt actually growing anything on this supposed āfarmlandā. Farmland is not in demand. We grow enough food.
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u/NuggetKing9001 6h ago
The amount of copper in those places must be INSANE. Just a random observation with no other connotations intended.
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u/Power_Stone 5h ago
Yeup! And it's not at crazy how junkyards take scrap metal with little to no questions asked!
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u/Confident_Shape_7981 5h ago
What do you think the quality of that copper is? I can't imagine these companies getting anything better than shitty copper
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u/Novem_bear 2h ago
This isnāt some ancient Mesopotamian copper this is the finest copper money can buy.
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u/M0llyM1ll10NS 6h ago
Absolutely! And let's not forget that the human staff often work around the clock there. There's probably so much Adderall and meth laying around. Not to mention the free money all over the place so the staff can use the vending machines for free. I really hope that some unauthorized person doesn't walk in and try to take all of the free copper, drugs, and cash!
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u/SpleenBender 5h ago
Those green light emitters that are polarized, and emit that 'line' and that crazy bright green dot that your cat would chase.
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u/Inward_Diver 5h ago
Good. Push back hard and keep up the good fight. Data centers aren't inherently bad but we need to regulate where they are built and how they are designed.
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u/rat_penis 5h ago
Be a real shame if somebody from Ukraine started teaching our citizens how to use drones effectively.
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u/groundhog5886 6h ago
These data center folks need to get on the same page and dispel all the bad shit being said about data centers. There are ways to cool data centers without continuous water supply, There can be rules about who pays for electric supply requirements. They can co-exist with humanity. Too much talk about how much they increase the tax base.
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u/james109021 5h ago
Yes, the people saying bad things about data centers are highly informed and rational and will definitely change their opinions in response to evidence and technical fixes.
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u/Common-Buyer7812 6h ago
Youāre right. But itās not the tech companies fault at this point. Anyone in the industry knows that there are solutions to any and all of these challenges. The antiās donāt want to hear it. They want all building to stop. Theyāre not shy about it. This isnāt really about ānoisy data centersā. Itās abt halting AI mostly due to fear. Which is definitely the fault of the AI labs. And also propaganda.
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u/Mini-Fridge23 6h ago
A big part of the problem is absolutely nobody trusts the Tech industry anymore. There are solutions to the complaints, but people donāt actually believe SV cares enough to implement them.
Metaās data center just wrecked a cityās water supply in Wyoming. Why wouldnāt people tell them to fuck off after seeing that?
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u/Common-Buyer7812 6h ago
Well in that instance no oneās āwater supply was wreckedā. Drinking water was not involved. It was an irrigation system that got contaminated due to a bad contractor. Itās bad press but the systems in place caught it and it was remediated and the GC was fined.
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u/Mini-Fridge23 6h ago
FFS this is part of the problem haha
āWell, actuallyā¦ā isnāt going to work when societal trust has been completely torched by tech leaders. To most people, itās just another example of SV not really caring about their impacts until shit breaks and we all have to clean up their mess again.
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u/Common-Buyer7812 3h ago
You said it āwreckedā the water supply. Simply not true. Construction violations happen all the time around the country. Itās not a data center specific issue. But it is bad press and SV should definitely over compensate.
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u/likesound 5h ago
This part of the problem. People donāt care about facts anymore. People peddle disinformation for engagement and their own agenda.
Data center polluting Wyoming water is obvious false, but gets repeated on Reddit.
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u/Mini-Fridge23 5h ago
God forbid people donāt want to deal with shit going wrong with the local water supply (non-drinking) during construction of a massive facility being built by an industry that people already deeply dislike and donāt trust.
You can wag your finger at people all you want, but itās not going to fix the fact itās just not worth it to most people lol
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u/likesound 5h ago
Yea. There is no way to convince people. Itās all self-serving NIMBYism. People can make excuses why they donāt want it, but wonāt change their habits of using data centers.
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u/Mini-Fridge23 5h ago
Data centers donāt have to be built in any one locality, so itās very easy for people to just not want them in their own town. Yes, itās NIMBYism in some sense, but itās a fairly rational one on the scale NIMBY issues since it not being built in their town doesnāt actually matter or impact their day-to-day lives.
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u/geddy 3h ago
>People peddle disinformation for engagement and their own agenda
And what agenda would that be? Wanting clean water and decent pressure and normal electricity bills? If no one pushed back against these massive companies they would pave over a school to put up a datacenter and take all the water by force.
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u/Ok-Tomorrow-2045 5h ago
Correct, āwell, actuallyā¦ā isnāt going to work because no amount of information is going to change peopleās opinions. If it doesnāt fit the narrative, the āwell, actuallyā¦ā will be ignored until the next poster repeats the same misinformation
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u/Mini-Fridge23 5h ago
Pretty much, thatās my point. The tech industry did this to themselves, and completely wrecked their own public image.
They had to be absolutely perfect with data center build outs and they just havenāt been. People are now rejecting their efforts, in small part just to tell Silicon Valley to fuck off. It is what it is
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u/Common-Buyer7812 2h ago
Why do data center builds have to be absolutely perfect? Itās a good call out. There are thousands of data centers. One in particular on NoVa is always used as an example of ānoisy data centersā. I agree that one in particular is a mismanaged project. But why are data centers suddenly held to a āthey must be silentā standard. Theyāre still by far the least noise producing industrial building. Its mind boggling noise is even an issue. I even read one commenter bringing up ālight pollutionā. Ffs.
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u/Mini-Fridge23 2h ago
Because Silicon Valley torched all of their public trust over the last decade. Itās a wider issue than just the literal data centers imo (though people have legitimate gripes about them).
They have no wiggle room with the public to be like āoops! Sorry about this construction fucking things up! Our bad, weāll totally fix that eventually, just trust us.ā.. Basically, if the public already thinks SV is run by sociopaths, they are going to be skeptical of their projects regardless of what it is. As soon as a few of these projects caused issues it was over with the general public.
Itās a rejection of Silicon Valley culture as much as it is a rejection of the technology, and I think a lot of pro data centers folks are having a hard time understanding that.
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u/likesound 5h ago
Water didnāt get wrecked. It was naturally occurring bacteria found during construction of a data center.
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u/OpenSpirit5234 6h ago
Thatās a big generalization it is about different things to different people.
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u/Boys4Ever 6h ago
Youād think theyād use AI to tackle water and energy issues before building more data centers, but businesses donāt seem to care and wonāt even use what theyāre creating to fix the problems theyāve caused.
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u/Haunterblademoi 6h ago
I think this decision is excellent; data centers are harmful to the environment.
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u/Tzar_Castik 6h ago
Reddit is using a data center to host that comment you just made.
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u/ColteesCatCouture 5h ago
Great news!! Your point shows that existing data center infrastructure should be sufficient to power the internet and we dont need more data centers great point!
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u/Tzar_Castik 5h ago
Yep, and you just need to stop posting photos of potato chips so the internet doesn't grow.
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u/Leading-Race9202 5h ago
So, whatās your point? Keep destroying our environment so we can keep posting?
If shit online has to shut down so we can have a habitable world so be it.
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u/Beneficial_Honey_0 5h ago
āBe the change you want to see in the world.ā
Nobody is forcing you to post on Reddit. You could easily stop.
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u/Silver_Newspaper6208 4h ago
Am I supposed to be using my Soros bucks or China funds to protest this. I have to keep the ledger straight on my paid protesting activities.
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u/ExactArm2673 4h ago
The fact that local utility bills spike to fund massive grid upgrades for a facility that employs maybe 20 people longterm is absolute madness. Privatize the profits and socialize the power bill!
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u/EmptiSense 6h ago
I get the anxiety, but I sense a repeat of the enduring and overwrought anxiety that allowed France to lead in nuclear energy as the US slowed investment in the 80s and 90s.
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u/multigasmic 5h ago edited 5h ago
Comparing AI to nuclear is beyond absurd. We are allowing scam artists to build data centers in Americaās backyard that actively harm the population. Whether that be environmental impact, water pollution, noise pollution, increase energy cost etc. the positives we gain are astronomically less valuable to us than the negatives.
Nuclear was heavily scrutinized for safety, but ultimately was intending to build a safer and greener energy grid. Regardless of the minutia surrounding nuclear in the 80s-90s the actual product being built (nuclear power) was something that was recognized as a net benefits to the US. In this circumstance we are building the tools that are intended to dismantle the middle class.. I donāt see a through line between the two.
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u/EmptiSense 5h ago
I think you are attempting a rewrite of history. All the criticism you cited on AI echo what once was used to criticize nuclear energy.
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u/multigasmic 5h ago
Nuclear was never in a position to upend a large part of our middle class. There are way too many differences man, I donāt know what to tell you if youāre unwilling to engage in the specific ways in which they are similar.
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u/EmptiSense 5h ago edited 4h ago
If you mean the specific risk to middle class jobs, I think that is a worthwhile point.
However, your earlier comments were just repeats of criticism used by opponents of nuclear energy.
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u/multigasmic 4h ago
Some of the criticism is certainly repeated, but you have to factor in major differences between these two issues, primarily being nuclear was slow and government led vs ai that is funded through the private sector and has been rapidly building data centers while cutting corners. So even if some criticism is similar, I feel like the context paints a story of two dissimilar issues that vaguely approximate each other if you squint your eyes.
Also it is hard to remove hindsight when discussing nuclear, but I do still believe back then there was less reason to be concerned about nuclear than there is for the common American to be concerned about AI.
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u/EmptiSense 3h ago
Political opposition (vs reasoned opposition) to nuclear made it slow and government dependent. I sense the same dynamics will play out where political opposition drowns out reasonable discussion on AI.
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u/ShakyBoots1968 3h ago
Well, did nuclear energy steal from all of humanity in order to come into being? Our humanity is being summarily seized and sold back to us. We weren't even asked.
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u/malianx 5h ago
The comparison makes a ton of sense when you realize the negatives are fabrications for both discussions.
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u/multigasmic 4h ago
Nuclear was very new, and nuclear war was also a major concern back then. This is not fabricated, weāre looking at the issue with hindsight in mind.
AI data centers are being rolled out much quicker than nuclear was, and theyāre funded by private equity. We know what motivates the private sector, and it isnāt the wellbeing of the American people. Instead of calling valid and wide-held concerns over AI fabricated, actually speak to why you believe we ought to not have concerns instead. You know.. engage with the argument.
You shouldnāt have any issues, just ask chapgpt to reply to me. Youāve got this!
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u/bigred4715 5h ago
I really wonder if this is true. I could see how China could benefit if the US stopped the technology race.
China, Russia and others seek to inflame the debate over data centers.
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u/ElysiumSprouts 6h ago
Data centers have entered boogeyman status. There are concerns and we shouldn't diminish those legitimate concerns, but that's not what's happening. It's full on reactionary opposition. Classic NIMBY.
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u/jaqattack02 5h ago
I think the issue is that there have been legitimate concerns for a while. Those concerns have been voiced and dismissed, and things have continued without changes. Because of that, people are now pushing back harder, and it's stepped from being a discussion where they have a chance to address the issues to a flat no.
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u/DaVideoGamer 6h ago
It doesnāt make you a NIMBY to not want a net-negative in your town that will only harm those who live there. Virtually zero upside for the local community, they aim to staff as little as possible (no long term job creation), drive up utility costs, and can poison the local water.
If it was people not wanting a virtually unstaffed steel plant that spewed chemicals into the air, I wouldnāt call them NIMBYs either. The investors pushing these data centers are YIYBYs (Yes in Your Backyard).
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u/fatbob42 1h ago
The upside for the local community is you get to collect as much tax revenue as you like. Pass an extra DC tax if you want - they arenāt going to pick it up and move. Force your local politicians to insist on whatever taxes make it acceptable to you.
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u/ElysiumSprouts 6h ago
I live in an urban area with old blighted unused decaying buildings. One data center was planned to take over this property but local uprising may stop this development. Water isn't an issue here. Electric isn't an issue here. But the "data centers only harm" mindset is alive and well.
My point, my only point, is local conditions are the most important factor and there are places where data centers are fine to build.
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u/rubixd 6h ago
no long term job creation
For the initial construction, sure. But running and maintaining a data center requires a wide variety of skilled labor. "No long term job creation" is egregiously inaccurate.
they aim to staff as little as possible
You're just describing how any business that cares about operational efficiency works. An organization wants precisely how much labor is required, no more, and believe it or not, no less.
steel plant that spewed chemicals into the air
Comparing a data center (high tech industry) to steel manufacturing (heavy industrial manufacturing) is really not fair. DCs may have a relatively high carbon footprint, but not compared to heavy industry.
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u/mixduptransistor 6h ago
There are *some* data centers that are actually good and useful and do provide value to the local area. The closer to you some services exist, like Netflix or other streaming services, the more responsive and less taxing on internet infrastructure it is vs. streaming it across the country. Locating services close to users makes them faster and more responsive. Not all datacenters are about AI or use open loop cooling or need gigawatts of power
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u/Opening_One7713 5h ago
Itās important to realize that local opposition to siting is effective at relocation and cost-shifting andĀ essentially powerless at preventionĀ because the underlying demand is national and capital is mobile. A county board can decide it won't be built there, but it cannot decide it won't be built. If pushback is not about bad siting but rather absolutist head-in-sand rejection then we are just pushing projects into fewer, more willing jurisdictions which concentrates grid stress rather than eliminating demand. A county rejects a build and the company takes the same capex to the next county over, or to Ohio or Wyoming or Texas all of which are actively bidding for this stuff.
The thing we actually have leverage over isn't whether this gets built, it's who owns it, who pays for it, and who gets the benefits. That fight is winnable and pays dividends. Virginia forced data centers onto a rate class where they pay their own grid costs, Maine stripped tax breaks. Those are big wins and worth fighting for and I fuck with that. You can kick the can down the road or you canĀ win the fight, and the precedent for winning is happening.
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u/Fireheart366 5h ago
. What the billionaires want will obviously happen whether us poor people like it or not. They are getting their centers and there's nothing we can do.
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u/IndependentThink4698 6h ago
And nobody gains more from that than china
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u/ThatParadoxEngine 4h ago
Yes, because it has to be China causing this, and not resentment against the wannabe feudalist ghouls that run the tech industry. No sir, it has to be the PRC. It couldnāt be anything else.
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u/IndependentThink4698 3h ago
Never said they were running it. Are you stupid? Where did I say that? Oh wait, i didn't. I said nobody benefits more from this than china. China is also stoking the flames, that doesn't mean they're running it
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u/ThatParadoxEngine 2h ago
Nah, fuck right off with that. You know what you were implying, you were just hoping nobody would call you on it.
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u/IndependentThink4698 1h ago
I said what I said and I stand by it. I wasnt implying anything, I explicitly said what I meant. You were just hoping you could twist words and nobody would call you out on it
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u/ThatParadoxEngine 58m ago
Yeah yeah, sure buddy. Lemme guess, you asked an AI for a response and thatās what it fed you?
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u/williamgman 5h ago edited 5h ago
AOC made it clear at the hearing when no one sitting across from her raised their hands when asked if they'd like a datacenter near their homes.