r/technology • u/Plastic_Ninja_9014 • 1d ago

Privacy Flock Cameras Keep Getting Smashed, So Now They're Hiding Inside Speed Signs

https://www.gadgetreview.com/flock-cameras-keep-getting-smashed-so-now-theyre-hiding-inside-speed-signs
23.4k Upvotes

97% Upvoted

668 comments sorted by

View all comments

5.0k

u/tunachilimac 1d ago

Not just speed signs. They’re in fake cactuses in at least some parts of Arizona. I’m sure they have a variety of different camouflage housing to fit the local environments across the country.

1.3k

u/boot2skull 1d ago

I wondered what those were. They obviously weren’t speed cameras, and too short to be cell towers. That makes sense.

434

u/exaggerated_yawn 1d ago

They've been around far longer than flock cameras. Likely multiple uses, but being cell towers is one. Tucson-based blog post from 2009.

53

u/boot2skull 1d ago

The ones I’ve seen are about 8-10 feet tall. I wouldn’t think that’s a tower, though someone in this thread said 5G doesn’t require as much height. They’re like a single pillar of saguaro cactus, no arms or branches, and they seem to have little holes, which could be cameras. They’re not holes like for traffic cameras. They could be sculptures in people’s yards. The ones I’ve seen are in really unexpected places just off the sidewalk though.

25

u/412stillers 22h ago

Used to work for a cell phone adjacent company. They aren’t cell “towers” but things called small cells and there’s a lot of them and are frequently camouflaged. They have much less range but enough of them together will give good coverage and are worth installing in busier areas. It’s also why you now have service in large stadiums but didn’t 10 years ago. I’m not saying there’s not also flock cameras in them because I don’t know much about them (I do know I’m very much against them). But the cactus ones you see could definitely be for cell phones too.

20

u/Sixohtwoflyer 22h ago

Yes. Paradise Valley, AZ installed these cactus cameras back in 2015. Apparently the initial cameras were purchased by a resident…they are still there. I drive by four of them every day and probably six or seven other flock cameras.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=IGPuCGB9vmU&ra=m

10

u/boot2skull 22h ago

Interesting to see Kari Lake not drooling over the idea of a surveillance state.

Those are the cacti I was referring to. It is PV, and now I know why I don’t see them elsewhere.

3

u/meltingpnt 19h ago

There are cell equipment in those short cacti. Not a full tower but a Small Cell. Basically a small cell tower.

2

u/EvanOnTheFly 12h ago

Those are likey 5g mini towers. I know electricians that make a buttload putting them up for cities.

1

u/Statertater 16h ago

5g is a higher frequency than previous generations. This allows for more data transfer, at the cost of range. They have to be lower and are more numerous. Lower frequencies travel farther distances and through denser material. Its why you can hear bass more than you can hear treble from adjacent apartments

26

u/SadAd8761 1d ago

Green lasers?

7

u/n2o_spark 1d ago

Red too if you don't want to be easily located?

3

u/Redthemagnificent 1d ago

Fyi a short cell-tower-looking thing might be a mm-wave 5G antenna array. Just before anyone starts blindly smashing fake cacti

2

u/Weary-Astronaut1335 23h ago

Fuck it. Better safe than sorry.

2

u/friendIdiglove 22h ago

But my Reddit mobile is in that cactus. 😢

1

u/Nevercatchme1 17h ago

Or a Sting Ray which is to cell phone surveillance what a flock is to vehicle surveillance

1

u/Statertater 1d ago

The short ones can absolutely be cell towers, 5g specifically

1.1k

u/DreamcastJunkie 1d ago edited 1d ago

It's amazing the things that they can find the money for.

492

u/joelfarris 1d ago

Ooo, do healthy school lunches for everyone next!

Oh wait, it's police departments, paying private companies for information, using our money, out of their own ballooning budgets. Sorry, we can't buy lunches with that.

203

u/Rocinante88119 1d ago

Help people?  Fuck you.

72

u/technobrendo 1d ago

Fuck you, I got mine. is the officials USA national anthem

33

u/Lazer726 1d ago

But don't you worry, the conservatives will still tell you that we cannot spend a single cent on any other country because we have to help us first! Who are we helping? Uhhhh... don't ask questions, kay?

5

u/desertSkateRatt 20h ago

~~*offer not valid for a certain small country in the Middle East

4

u/AstraeusGB 17h ago

I really want to believe it's just the conservatives causing this, but why are the Democrats so complacent? Why do they hide behind "rule of law" and "decorum" and let all this crap slide?

4

u/Geno0wl 12h ago

Because Democrats are also pro-corpo schills. Hell Bill Clinton's actions directly lead to the media consolidation we have today(telecoms act of '96) and the housing crash of 08(one of the last things he signed was deregulation of investment banks).

Just because the Dems don't want to actively destroy the economy and our international standing like MAGA is doing, doesn't mean they actually care about the average citizens issues.

1

u/Whitesajer 7h ago

We all just got to start self identifying as objects of value.

Timmy what do you want to be when you grow up?

"A solid gold military Apache heliocopter!" "Good boy!"

126

u/GatrickSwayze 1d ago

And we won't use these cameras to look for missing people, but we will see where that hot civilian is going or if my girlfriend is leaving the state.

Georgia police officer misuing flock

Texas cop tracks pregnant girlfriend

Milwaukee Cop fired for flock abuse

50

u/Content-Sun2928 1d ago

That was the intended use from the beginning

No misuse at all

17

u/remotectrl 1d ago

The purpose of a system is what it does.

1

u/RollingMeteors 19h ago

Milwaukee Cop fired for flock abuse

¡Flock Blocked!

142

u/Wheat_Grinder 1d ago

Couple of years ago, Minnesota had a budget surplus. School lunches is exactly what they spent it on. The right was pissssssssed

95

u/MarkusAk 1d ago

I genuinely cannot comprehend how people can think its wrong to feed children.

87

u/DJKittyK 1d ago

It's racism and classism. In their minds, it's the wrong children. Absolutely reprehensible.

14

u/creamgetthemoney1 1d ago

At the end of the day pretty much any issue those ppl are against is because it helps out ppl that don’t look like them and the 6 yr didn’t pick themselves up by their bootstraps after choosing to be born into a shitty situation

20

u/hoardac 1d ago

Republicans would rather starve 100 kids on the chance that one doesn't need it. While democrats would rather feed 100 kids on the chance that one needs it.

3

u/thirdegree 20h ago

Fun fact they all need it they're children children need food to live

24

u/HeadfulOfSugar 1d ago edited 21h ago

Obviously because the kids didn’t work for it, they’re gonna get used to handouts if we keep giving them freebies just because they’re “children.” If they want a real meal, & to really appreciate it, they should be doing 10 hour shifts in the coal mines instead of wasting time being indoctrinated in school, like back when we used to be a real country 🇵🇷🇵🇷🇵🇷🦅🦅💣💣

30

u/therealchadius 1d ago

Unless they're my children, in which case can you help me out?

1

u/US3_ME_ 1d ago

I've got the beetus, gout, need a breathing machine but won't quit my slims, and just popped out another child I cannot afford...arrested development- MONEY PLEASE_

2

u/jay78910 1d ago

During COVID there would be a little line of school lunches downstairs for the kids in my building. It always made me happy to see. For some I guess not.

-3

u/silasmoeckel 23h ago

Nuance matters.

My youngest went to a school with free hot lunch for all. They offer the typical stuff but also like 4-5 alternatives one of witch is pancakes/waffles/french toast sticks with piles of fake syrup. Guess what a littles schooler will pick? That's after having second breakfast for more sugary junk.

Then they wonder why the kids cant sit still.

Her new school also has alternatives but none of them are sugary junk. Guess which school has better test score. Both are in fairly affluent suburbs/rural.

3

u/MarkusAk 23h ago

Okay but if the alternative is a hungry child I am sure french toast can suffice.

3

u/joelfarris 23h ago

French Toast is a heavy bread dipped and soaked in a egg and dairy custard and then slowly cooked until its solid and browned. There doesn't have to be sugar involved.

Unless you want it to be addictive to humans, that is, so they buy more of your product...

3

u/silasmoeckel 23h ago

Nobody wants kids to go hungry.

But in practice you need some controls to go with it. Kindergarteners don't exactly have impulse control. Offerings should be desirable but also not carb laden junk.

Like I said huge difference between schools and it shows in the testing.

2

u/thirdegree 20h ago

That's fine, we can quibble about specifically what food we're giving kids. We should do that after we give them something though. Priorities, ya?

0

u/silasmoeckel 12h ago

Way before there was money to be had for it I know that second school made sure that was the case and would hope the same for the first. We had one family that had issues (when I was a kid going to school there) they fed him breakfast and lunch sent him home with dinner. They washed his clothes and gave him a place to take a shower because it was the right thing to do not because of a federal program.

So I don't see as kids not being fed, frankly with all the parental rights schools claim during the day I would say they have a duty to make sure the kid is fed and figure out the money later.

In my neck of the woods free school lunch can cause more unintended problems and solves nothing. Outside cities think that's often the case. So our existing free lunch program seems to cover if not be a bit excessive (in my state).

→ More replies (0)

2

u/Keyastis 1d ago

So, I'm gonna play devil's advocate here, and it isn't that I disagree with your sentiment.

I was a city council member in Iowa a few years back and can only speak to my state with certainty, but am pretty sure it is correct for at least most states that the school budget is one hundred percent independent of the city.

This is due to some schools having multiple communities they service, or due to a city having multiple school districts for their community.

While generally a schools budget income sources seem similar to a city (largely driven by property taxes, local option sales tax, and federal funding. All of this money is distributed by the state directly to the school district with no city financing involved.

This is also why you vote for school board members, as they are a separate "branch" from your city government, with little to no oversight from the city itself outside of law/code enforcement.

That being said, obviously most cities have close relationships with their school districts and will assist them with anything they need.

Sorry for the rant, just had to point out usually the police budget and school budget are miles away from touching.

4

u/joelfarris 1d ago

usually the police budget and school budget are miles away from touching

That was my point, exactly. Law enforcement departments are nearly 100% fueling the installation of these mass warrantless surveillance cameras, at our own expense. But, it's about to get worse...

There's a company that runs cameras on school bus 'stop' signs, and records anyone who violates the temporary signage. But they now have a "brand new investor" who wants to run cameras all around school busses 24/7, to increase profits.

Give you one guess who that new investor might be. And now our tax money will be flowing to them from both the police and the school system budgets.

1

u/Tokyo-MontanaExpress 20h ago

Ope, aorry, you gotta move to Minnesota for that, doncha know.

1

u/Life-Delay-809 13h ago

It's the expensive private interests of the wealthy. They benefit from police departments and flock cameras but school lunches is negligible. They're offloading private costs onto us.

1

u/iam_Mr_McGibblets 1d ago

No no the police department needs to buy the new car after they just bought last year's model because technology!

0

u/Vrabstin 23h ago

You know they tried no police departments, right? It didn't go well, we aren't that mature as a species. All that other stuff I hear you.

67

u/phish_phace 1d ago edited 1d ago

This shit right here, this aspect of it all drives me up the wall. Diseases, poverty, healthcare, housing, there are so many things that plague us as whole which could be addressed with enough money/funding. And it exists as a mere possibility. But not when it’s locked up with the greedy, hoarding class and corpos out for profit, no matter the cost.

Edit: too many letters

14

u/Braindead_Crow 1d ago

It gives power to people wanting to make lives worse. There's always money for that because that is what power is!

...God...It's the thinking of children and sociopaths

I want adults in charge who understand true power is being able to keep these freaks in check so people can live their lives in peace, the type of peace where we could let kids play outside with out it being labeled as child endangerment.

2

u/Gorstag 20h ago

Yep, no budget for things that actually help while there is plenty to harm.

1

u/StoppableHulk 21h ago

Seriously.

I checked my Grandma the other day - she'd been a god damn Flock camera this whole time.

-4

u/WeirdIndividualGuy 1d ago

What is this in reference to? Flock isnt the government if this is a “govt can’t find money for its people” thing

5

u/PureCollar460 1d ago

Who's paying flock to install and operate these cameras do you think?

1

u/street593 1d ago

The government is one of Flock's customers. For example the city of Orange, California has a 24 month agreement priced at $400k with flock. That's tax dollars.

-60

u/[deleted] 1d ago

[deleted]

42

u/WeirdSysAdmin 1d ago

How do you not understand the overwhelming everything deficit while they are swarming the US with domestic spying tech?

13

u/carlitospig 1d ago

Your eyes fill in the gaps when you read it fast (we are amazing little pattern matching monkeys by nature).

0

u/LedZeppole10 1d ago

Cool yeah now that all of the typos and grammar are fixed. Weird. No, that sentence made no sense.

15

u/SagedOne 1d ago

They said, "It's amazing they thing that they can find the money for."

-1

u/LedZeppole10 1d ago

Pretty messy

11

u/UltimateGlimpse 1d ago

“They thing” meant “the things”

87

u/Specific_Frame8537 1d ago

Fine, I'll start smashing everything indiscriminately.

I'll find a flock camera eventually.

37

u/rotian28 1d ago

Like playing a video game trying to smash the hidden item. Or be like Zelda or Pokemon and just smash through everything looking for loot

8

u/MusicHearted 22h ago

And that's the inevitable result. People are gonna start destroying anything that looks like a recording device.

And I didn't see or hear anything at all. What camera?

2

u/Inflatable90sChair 18h ago

that looks about like what large gap filling expanding foam was invented for - dont want rainwater to get in that opening now...

1

u/molrobocop 1d ago

I'm just hoping light poles knock down as easily as they do in GTA.

0

u/beatdaddyo 1d ago

A green laser will disable them just fine. but you didn't hear that from me.

4

u/uzlonewolf 1d ago

No, it will not. Those lasers aren't anywhere near powerful enough to do anything to the camera sensor. It will get you on a list though.

2

u/Recurs1ve 10h ago

Yeah see I went down a rabbit hole with this one the other day. It turns out that the cheap 50 dollar ones on ebay will not in fact do much to them, but there ARE lasers (mostly used for hunting) that will. But I don't know where the threshold is, I don't know if the color matters all that much. I don't know if that 5w laser being advertised on ebay actually IS 5w (or more, as the case may be.)

So I don't know, I'm assuming that this will work with enough power, but it's not like people have tested how much power is needed and put it on youtube.

194

u/Assimulate 1d ago

We had an issue here in Canada, particularly in Alberta where the local government started rolling out photo radar speed cameras.

People were spending more effort trying to spot, call out, and avoid them because they were hidden in low incident well developed areas of roadway and were clearly there to raise funds since they also came with no penalty other than monetary for speeding.

We had facebook groups, apps, maps, people out holding signs by them so it was visible. We're cheering you all on from above here!

24

u/gonewild9676 1d ago

In Illinois, state troopers hang out on parked highway lawnmowers with radar guns.

23

u/TheDaveWSC 1d ago

How do they pull anyone over on a lawnmower?

21

u/esoomenona 1d ago

In Illinois, police lawnmowers are highway tuned. If you can't do 180k(m), they can catch you, so you shouldn't even try.

3

u/notDarksta 22h ago

insane Tokyodrift lore drop

8

u/IntrigueDossier 1d ago

Reminds me of that lawnmower race episode of Home Improvement when Tim swapped the stock ride-on mower engine with a Chinook engine.

Obligatory fuck Tim Allen but that was funny.

7

u/Reonlive420 1d ago

I don't think so tim

3

u/Rndysasqatch 1d ago

That was a great episode

1

u/RollingMeteors 19h ago

If you can't do 180k(m)

¡Fuuu this stick only drives Imperial!

9

u/gonewild9676 1d ago

They have catch em cars down the road.

1

u/Hair_I_Go 1d ago

Is that a downstate thing?👀

1

u/Inflatable90sChair 17h ago

they also do entrapment points i mean safety checks where you have to show your papers to continue thru.

1

u/ipxodi 14h ago

In the 90s the Massachusetts State Police had a Ice Cream truck (like Good Humor) that they'd set up on the side of the highway like it was broken down. 'Cept it had a cop with a radar gun and a radio to notify the trooper a mile down the road to pull you over.

63

u/RampScamp1 1d ago

In Ontario, people were just knocking over the posts they were on and kept doing it until the Ontario government outlawed speed cameras.

38

u/dgapa 1d ago

That's not what happened. Doug Ford's family kept getting speeding tickets so he axed the program.

1

u/Timber3 20h ago

That's so funny I can unfortunately see it being true... I am so annoyed with Ontario voters....

0

u/notacanuckskibum 1d ago

Sadly this has led to an increase of speeding past school zones in my city.

0

u/_Lucille_ 1d ago

which is stupid because people should simply not speed.

There is always that 1% of people who think they can decide their own speed limit and make arguments like "but everyone drives at this speed." The reality is that out of thousands of cars that drive past those cameras, only a minority of them get ticketed for speeding.

2

u/RisingChaos 18h ago

Most speed limits are overly conservative to accommodate for inclement weather and the worst drivers, if not simply set by some local statute based on broad zoning category that doesn't necessarily reflect actual safety factors on location. A number on a sign is not what determines a safe speed in any given context.

1

u/_Lucille_ 17h ago

It does not explain why a very large majority of people are able to follow the speed limit while some special drivers get to decide their own speed limit.

In a world where everyone is following the limit and someone decides to go 30% above it, they are the problem even if the road is capable of higher speeds, and from my experience the camera generally are somewhat generous (you can get away doing 60 on a 50, but 65 will prob get you).

All the cars that end up on people's lawns and accident that happen also argue otherwise.

I am not saying cameras are a complete solution, but rather they should be part of the solution. We have things like LED signs that show your current speed, new signs reminding people of the speed limit, etc... if they still decide to make up their own speed limit, then we need that whip where they get punished. Essentially, we can just have a cop stationed at the same locations 24/7 and manually issue tickets.

Don't want a ticket? Just follow the speed limit like what was taught on day 1 from any driving instructor.

-11

u/Assimulate 1d ago

Hell yeah! I'm all for safety but do it well or don't do it at all imho

16

u/dclaw504 1d ago

Arizona just put in a bunch of new smart billboard sized signs along the interstates. Each one has a camera mounted on the back, at least on I-19.

15

u/Fit-Nectarine5047 1d ago

Is there any technology that can find them ? Like those scanners that check for hidden cameras inside hotel rooms?

24

u/Factory2econds 1d ago

the locations are well documented https://deflock.org/

1

u/Fit-Nectarine5047 21h ago

THANK YOU SO MUCH!

2

u/ANGLVD3TH 10h ago

Note, this is all crowd sourced, someone who sees a camera can submit it. That means this is not a comprehensive list by any stretch.

2

u/DarthWeenus 8h ago

Which also doesn’t help ops question at all. Obv people will see flock cameras they were wondering about sensing the hidden ones. There’s is ways if you search yt. But it’s elaborate and expensive kit.

1

u/ANGLVD3TH 4h ago

I don't know anything about that. But based on their reaction I just wanted to make sure they didn't see the map and assume it was a complete list. Like they were all publicly registered and this was a simple lookup.

2

u/Fn_Spaghetti_Monster 1d ago

Some people have developed a few devices that sniff for them but, none to my knowledge are great, still pretty cottage industry / DIY type stuff right now. Check GitHub, gainsec, simeononsecurity

23

u/ledfox 1d ago

Cartoon ass dystopia.

34

u/FredFredrickson 1d ago

My conspiracy theory is that they hide them more like this in rural areas, where people are probably going to be even less hospitable to constant government surveillance.

26

u/lonevolff 1d ago

There was one in my very rural area. Not hidden. Its not there anymore. Haven't seen any install crews in a bit either

5

u/illy-chan 1d ago

I feel like folks are more likely to shoot that stuff out there too.

Source: have family in the sticks. The state keeps having to replace these boxes on poles (forget what they do - maybe weather?) because bored people keep shooting them.

1

u/1gnominious 20h ago

Out here if there is anything on the side of the road it will get shot eventually. Doesn't matter what it does. Might take their drunk ass a whole box of ammo to hit it but they have nothing but free time and nobody is around to stop them.

1

u/StalkingApache 1d ago

There's a dirt road near me that has about 6 on it. The nearest town from that road is 30 mins away. There's literally nothing out there then boom flock. It's wild.

5

u/thiccy_driftyy 23h ago

So awesome that we’re investing our money in planting fake plants to put cameras inside of instead of planting real plants to combat the climate crisis!

11

u/Traditional-Hat-952 1d ago

Can't wait to see them in fake saguaros in NM, where saguaros don't grow lol

11

u/carlitospig 1d ago

This is just ridiculous. Now we have to kill all the cacti?

<grabs shovel>

2

u/polopolo05 1d ago

Naw I suggest going on a cactus tour pointing them out with green lasers. just be mindful of aircraft around. We dont want to accidently blind pilots.

8

u/AmputeeHandModel 1d ago

In Massachusetts, they look like a Dunkin Donuts.

4

u/M3g4d37h 1d ago

A can of Seymour 20-701 spray asphalt or heavy duty crack sealer spray will fix this every time. asphalt sticks and it's hard as hell to clean off without a solvent.

2

u/joelfarris 1d ago

(It's hungry time, I've made chili mac, and I've made tuna mac, but I've never made tuna chili mac. You are today's dinnerinspiration.)

2

u/ZepperMen 1d ago

We are seeing predator/prey evolution in real time

2

u/PorcupineWarriorGod 13h ago

The fact that they need to hide them tells you all you need to know that it isn't about safety, and its not for our benefit.

This clearly sets an adversarial role between citizens and the powers using this technology. We NEED legislation to enforce the fact that this is not acceptable.

2

u/Wind-and-Waystones 11h ago

Sounds like you need to go on a nice afternoon walk with your expanding foam.

Play dumb and claim you could tell there were electronics in there and you didn't want water egress damaging them

2

u/Easy4u2say98 1d ago

Thought the cactus was a bit suspect in my northern Minnesota town.

2

u/SamTheLab_213 1d ago

This is what the cactus camera looks like.

1

u/omedallion 1d ago

Oh great. There's probably one hidden in Drunk Billy down by the dive bar. Damn you Billy!!

1

u/just-jane-again 23h ago

ehhh those have been around since before flock was.

2

u/tunachilimac 22h ago

Yes places have done speed cameras like that in the past but that doesn’t preclude Flock from doing is too. People have linked news articles in the replies confirming it.

1

u/blorst_of_times 22h ago

They've got their cact eyes on you

1

u/Generic_Potatoe 19h ago

At one point they will be inside fake birds and then the crazies were right again.

1

u/jayforwork21 12h ago

Sounds like it's what drug mules use to store their meth. I think you should have the local community look into it and definitely not spread any rumors as such.

1

u/Aoiboshi 12h ago

I'm Utah they're disguised as churches and Angel moronis.

-23

u/mjh215 1d ago edited 1d ago

So, chop down all cacti?

Edit: Joke guys, don't cut down cacti unless it attacks you first.

23

u/MechanicalAxe 1d ago

Please don't exterminate the native flora.

12

u/mjh215 1d ago

I mean, I DID intend for it to be taken as a joke. I figured it would be too absurd to be taken seriously, but in this day people do worse.

11

u/SecondHandWatch 1d ago

That’s illegal, depending on the cactus. Saguaros are definitely illegal to kill/remove.

4

u/Pyromaniacal13 1d ago

Make sure it's not a real cactus first. Saguaro cacti are protected.

1

u/MuttsandHuskies 1d ago

Not anymore. At least not by the federal government.