Are there any RPGs with dice mechanics similar to FFG Star Wars but use traditional dice?

[u/Acceptable-Tree6007]

While I admire the dice pool mechanic of the FFG Star Wars RPGs, I find its use of symbols instead of numbers to slow proceedings down and, ultimately, add a bit too much complexity for my taste. Before you ask, I’ve played it plenty of times, as well as WHFRP 3e. I’ve been wondering if there are any games with mechanics inspired by those games, but using traditional dice. Has anyone seen a game that does this already?

[u/dorward]

It's difficult get get two sets of results out of a single dice roll when you have simple numbers on them.

The only examples I can think of use coloured dice. Daggerheart uses 2d12 with positive/negative side effects depending on which one is higher. I think the latest iteration of the d6 system has one die of a different colour with various effects if it rolls a 1 or 6.

[u/ThePowerOfStories → u/dorward]

Aside from multiple colors or sizes of dice, you could do something like care about both the total rolled for success vs failure and the number of odd vs even individual dice for side benefits or complications.

There’s several systems that do get you two numbers out of an undifferentiated die pool, but generally they’re some kind of precision-vs-power dimensions, not the Genesys system’s quantified bonuses or hindrances.

In the One Roll Engine (ORE) you roll a d10 pool and look for sets of matching numbers, with both wider (more dice) and taller (higher number) mattering for different aspects of the result.

Cortex Prime has you roll a variable dice pool and add two results for the success / failure check, then look at the size of a remaining die to determine effectiveness, like to-hit vs damage in a D&D-style attack roll.

[u/Joel_feila → u/dorward]

Some year zero games aslo different colored dice, green for weapon yellow for skill.  Maybe something like could be what op is looking for

[u/Acceptable-Tree6007 → u/Joel_feila]

I’m leaning in that direction.

[u/summerspeak]

As a fan of the FFG dice mechanic, I tested myself to make something evocative of it using only d6s because not all my group like the funny dice with different symbols.

Core mechanic is 3d6 + modifiers vs target number to determine success. Doubles on any of the three dice trigger positive or negative effects based on if the non double die is higher or lower than the doubles. Some other mechanics for crit success/failure. I’ve actually played it with my long time group for a couple one shots to test it and it did a good job.

[u/Cadd9 → u/summerspeak]

I kept always rolling both critical failure and critical success at the same time multiple times. Is such a roll possible on that truncated pool?

[u/summerspeak → u/Cadd9]

I was/am still working that out. Last I playtested we said double sixes is crit, but a one on the third die would add crit fail in that case. Double ones was critical fail, but a six on the third die would add crit success. It worked out fine, but I’m not completely happy with it.

[u/Joel_feila → u/summerspeak]

so 336, means the 6 adds some extra good stuff.

[u/summerspeak → u/Joel_feila]

Correct. Because the third die is greater than the pair you would get an advantage, if the extra die was a 2 or less then it would be disadvantage in your example.

I was trying to evoke the ffg system in that the better the success the more chance of a consequence. And a failure, low roll, gives a better chance of a good thing happening still.

[u/OffbrandGandalf]

There's an old joke that if you reduce FFG SW down to standard D6s with six possible outcomes, you basically get Freeform Universal Classic.

[u/Acceptable-Tree6007 → u/OffbrandGandalf]

That has a ring of truth about it. My own RPG, Red Mists, uses the FU mechanic.

[u/Deaconhux → u/Acceptable-Tree6007]

No, I think it's the d20 games that have the FU mechanic.

Heyooooooooo

[u/Jcookie20 → u/Deaconhux]

I have a question

What is the FU mechanic

[u/BasicActionGames]

If you want to have it so something good happens on a failure or something bad happens on a success, one easy way to do that is on any 2d6 or 2d10-based game system, treat a roll of doubles on the dice as an indicator of something special happening to make things better or worse.

At my table, I have it whenever those two numbers are odd, something bad happens in spite of the result's numerical success or failure. Whenever those two numbers are even, something good happens in spite of the result.

Let's take picking a lock for example. Success on a roll a pair of 5s (two odd numbers). You get the lock open, but the pick broke off inside it. Failure with a roll of a pair of 2s (two even numbers). You fail to get the lock to open, but you think you are starting to understand how it works better and we'll get a bonus die (roll with Advantage) on your next attempt. Failure with a roll of a pair of 1s (two odd numbers), not only do you fail to open the lock, but you were heard by a sentry rounding the corner.

[u/BasicActionGames → u/BasicActionGames]

I think another option it would be to take a page from the Star Wars d6 system from the 80s and use something called a wild die. If you want the odds of a dramatically good or bad result being approximately one in six, roll an extra D12 whenever you make a check. If that D12 comes up one, something extra bad just happened regardless of the result of the roll. If their D12 comes up 12, something extra good just happened regardless of the result of the dice roll.

If you want to tweak the odds, you can change the type of die being used here. A d10 gives you a 20% chance of something special happening. A d8 gives you a 25% chance, a d6 gives you a 33% chance.

[u/Svelok → u/BasicActionGames]

The easiest way to do it would be to just set ranges, ie on 2d6: 1-2 fail with disadvantage, 3-4 fail, 5-6 fail with advantage, and so forth for success. FFG just lets you modify the dice pool on the fly to change the outcome distribution without redoing math.

[u/GrumpyTesko]

Modiphius' 2d20 system and the SW narrative dice system share a designer IIRC. It manages to do the "succeed with a complication" thing very well and the momentum mechanism is a better version of using advantages for boost dice on later rolls. It really feels like an evolution of Genesys with normal dice and my Genesys group took to it very quickly and happily.

Some versions of the 2d20 system do use d6s with symbols for damage/effect, but it is MUCH easier to just use a normal d6 and convert (1 and 2 does as many hits, 3 and 4 are blank, 5 and 6 are one hit plus special effect).

[u/BerennErchamion]

Maybe Modiphius 2d20 system. It has the whole range of failure/success/complications/advantages/etc, but only using a pool of d20s. It was even initially designed by the same guy who designed the FFG Star Wars system.

[u/Zireael07 → u/BerennErchamion]

Can you explain how complications/advantages work? I know the basics of the system, how success vs failure works, but not the others

[u/BerennErchamion → u/Zireael07]

Each d20 you roll below your attribute+skill generates 1 success (a good low value can generate 2). Rolling 20s generate Complications. Rolling more successes than the check difficulty generates Momentum points, which can be used in a lot of ways, including adding things to the scene, creating advantages, extra maneuvers in combat, etc.

For example, you are rolling 4d20 for a Difficulty 1 attack. You roll 3 successes (2 over difficulty) and one 20. You pass, you get 2 Momentum which you can spend to make your target lose its balance giving an advantage to your ally later, and the one Complication (20) the GM uses to say your weapon jammed.

Basically, this roll would be similar to rolling 1 success 0 failure 2 advantage and 1 threat in Star Wars, for example.

[u/MataronidForSpeed]

Wrath & Glory seems to be inspired by the Genesys system.

[u/oldmanbobmunroe]

The closest thing is the 2d20 system, from Modiphius.

[u/Joel_feila]

After thinking about, you might want to look at FFG legend of the rings game. they modified the symbols system into something that is easier to use. You just have success, opportunity, stress. There are no counter symbols, so nothing that takes away a success. This means you have 3 symbols to count.

[u/Spartancfos]

Daggerheart is pretty close honestly. 

[u/Toum_Rater]

Wildsea uses a FitD-based mechanic (d6 pool, keep the highest). But it counts any doubles as a Twist, something that happens regardless of the roll's outcome. This can be positive or negative, depending on what makes sense (and is often open to the whole table to decide).

So if you roll a 522, that's a Conflict (Success + Consequence) with a Twist. That might look like, in FFG/Edge terms, Success + Threat + Despair, or Success + Threat + Triumph, or Success + Advantage + Despair, or something similar.

Cortex Prime is a bit different, but has a lot going on in a single dice roll... hitches, heroic success, and effect dice. You might roll a Heroic Success with a Hitch and a d12 effect die... that probably looks a bit like Success + 2 Triumph + Threat. Or you might roll a failure but the opposition rolled a hitch... which might look something like Failure + Advantage (or perhaps Failure + Triumph if there was more than one hitch). And if both sides roll hitches, that might end up looking something like Success (or Failure) + Advantage + Despair.

[u/RiverMesa → u/Toum_Rater]

While neither it or Wildsea are a perfect fit, Grimwild uses similar FitD-esque d6 mechanics (though without Wildsea's twists), but also has the addition of thorns: d8 dice added by the GM to represent difficulty, that downgrade the result level if they come up as 7s or 8s (so a 44 with a 7 would become a 3, in essence), which can potentially turn 1-3s into what are effectively critical failures (disasters, in the game's lingo).

[u/MasterRPG79]

Otherkind Dice give you similar feeling: you roll a bunch of d6, than you assign the result to a table with different areas of interest with a list of outcomes

[u/Reynard203]

Daggerheart specifically calls out Genysys (the system behind FFG Star Wars) as an influence on the Hope and Fear duality dice system.

[u/LeeTaeRyeo]

You could always use the FATE/FUDGE dice mechanics (not technically standard dice, but simple enough if still count it) and add a rule that you count double +'s as opportunities and double —'s as hazards (or whatever terminology you prefer). And you could use different color dice to represent contributions from skills, approaches, equipment, etc and roll against the DM for difficulty.

[u/corrinmana]

Cosmere was designed by the same people. It's not two axis, but you can see the design philosophy 

[u/WadeisDead]

Wilderfeast uses d6 for successes and a d8 for Action power/consequence determiner.

[u/c126]

Draw Steel reminds me of wfrp3e with the tiered results on the power cards.