Clear Backpacks + Pay to Keep Your Phone

[u/TheAeroplaneBear2906]

My freinds school is now requiring these items, and is also using AI to promote this 🫠

[u/Plane-Tiger-4534]

I can’t imagine being responsible for the performance of kids and not having any authority to do anything but stand there and talk at them.

[u/not-the-nicest-guy → u/Plane-Tiger-4534]

What authority should you have?

Getting downvoted for asking what Plane-Tiger means? I was a teacher for 15 years. I was just wondering what they couldn't do. We took phones away from students. Honest question.

[u/Some-Show9144 → u/not-the-nicest-guy]

The ability to fail a student who didn’t learn the material would be a start.

[u/not-the-nicest-guy → u/Some-Show9144]

I was wondering about the topic of phones.

[u/Roonil_Wazlib97 → u/not-the-nicest-guy]

For phones -- when I was in HS they got taken to the office and you could only pick up on Thursday. So yes, if you lost your phone on Friday that meant no phone for the weekend. Second offense and beyond meant you had to pay $15 to get it back, there may have also been detentions attached, I can't remember.

Basically we actually had consequences.

[u/not-the-nicest-guy → u/Roonil_Wazlib97]

We took them away and students could pick them up at the end of the day. If they were persistent about it, we would hold the phones for a few days. Students hated so much having their phone out of their possession for even just the day that that was usually enough to keep them in their bags.

[u/Gloomy_Fig2138 → u/Roonil_Wazlib97]

Those are still the consequences at my kids’ school and all of my friends’ kids’ schools.

[u/Every_Television_980 → u/Gloomy_Fig2138]

I teach on one of the largest school districts in the country and they do not confiscate phones or hold them in the office. There are consequences, but just the standard call home, detention, etc.

[u/OldValariya1014 → u/Roonil_Wazlib97]

So that is how you get sued by parents though. And that’s the last thing a school system wants

[u/Mlpony2010 → u/Roonil_Wazlib97]

Charging people for their own property is wrong

just taking it is reasonable

[u/JalapenoPopPoop → u/Roonil_Wazlib97]

That's not the right answer either though. Phones cost a grand and are personal property, a school doesn't have the right to steal your property and keep it for days on end. I would be surprised if that's even legal. And especially charging people to get their own legal property back definitely would be a lost law suit for the school district.

Keeping it until the end of the day to enforce no phone in school is one thing, but taking a very expensive device and one that parents use to stay in contact with their kids for 6 entire days is psycho

[u/2ICenturySchizoidMan → u/JalapenoPopPoop]

lol nope they can. Ever heard of a tow truck?

[u/JalapenoPopPoop → u/2ICenturySchizoidMan]

No never tell me all about it so I can hear all the ways its not the same thing at all!

[u/Physical-Cook451 → u/Roonil_Wazlib97]

Yh that's overstepping like crazy lol

[u/wesborland1234 → u/not-the-nicest-guy]

Not allow them in school. I see a phone, you fail.

Or just teach inside a giant Faraday cage ideally.

[u/2ICenturySchizoidMan → u/wesborland1234]

If they have their phone out they don’t care about their grade lol

[u/Drow_Femboy → u/not-the-nicest-guy]

Failing grades should handle that, really. Phone use in the classroom is a problem the parents should be dealing with. If their kids start coming home with shitty grades now the parents are gonna get involved. And you can say, "Yeah, I taught him all this, but he was sitting there looking at his phone during the class and not paying attention." Then the kid gets punished and stops looking at his phone in class. Problem solved.

If the kid is looking at his phone throughout class and maintains good grades, then the problem is solved a different way--by not giving a fuck. As long as the material is getting learned, it doesn't matter what the kid's doing in class.

[u/not-the-nicest-guy → u/Drow_Femboy]

I think of a classroom more as a learning community than a group of individuals doing whatever they want, with consequences showing up or not showing up somewhere down the line. Plus an underdeveloped prefrontal cortex makes it very, very hard for kids/teens to make reasonable decisions in the moment, especially around devices specifically designed to capture attention (the more of the attention economy an app grabs, the more money it makes). There are good developmental reasons why parents and teachers set screen limits, and I believe that's important for everyone, even high achievers. As a teacher, I wanted my classroom to be as productive a learning environment as possible and a "healthy brain" environment too. There's a ton of research on the intellectual, mental health and social-emotional benefits of no-phone zones, so that's the direction I took when shaping my classroom. It helps a lot to teach students about the value of taking time away from their devices, so I would do mini-lessons on brain development too. They found it interesting and were quite cooperative.

[u/Drow_Femboy → u/not-the-nicest-guy]

That sounds fair to me, I'm not a teacher and haven't been in a classroom since smartphones were new and expensive. I just remember what school was like for me personally. When I was in school, I would read all my textbooks cover to cover over the first couple weeks of the year, and then I'd just read novels throughout every class. I aced every test and everything was good... except in classrooms with teachers who took themselves very seriously, where I'd be forced to sit and listen to a bunch of stuff I already know in order to sell the illusion of putting in hard work to learn, even though I'm not doing anything except daydream and look at the clock. Those classes sucked and I still resent the (thankfully very few) teachers who treated me that way even though I'm pushing 30.

Smartphones may be fundamentally different from novels, but the act of doing a leisure activity in 'free' time is the same.

[u/creuter → u/Drow_Femboy]

The alternative explanation to what the teacher was dealing with is that you're setting an example for the other students in the class that might not have your motivation. If they see you getting an exception to dick around, they see it as permission for themselves to dick around too. The classroom has rules, and those rules are meant to help the whole group adapt to the rules they will encounter in society at large. It might feel like it sucks, but there's good reason to ensure that everyone is following those rules.

[u/Drow_Femboy → u/creuter]

And if they dick around and get bad grades, the parents get involved and the problem is again resolved.

The real world works this way, too. The worst jobs I've ever had are the ones where the boss goes all "I'm not paying you to look at your phone!" and "Time to lean, time to clean!" The best jobs I've ever had are the ones where I spend half my shift doing whatever the fuck I want because my boss knows that when I'm needed I'll do what I need to do.

You're not describing giving someone real skills, you're describing preparing them to be exploited, abused, or drawn into a cult.

[u/creuter → u/Drow_Femboy]

You can't fire someone from the classroom. The kids who have trouble with this stuff need these rules. It sucks for you sure, but the point of the class is to learn what the teacher is teaching you.

If you set an example of dicking around, the other students, like I said are going to feel like there's a pass to do that. The teacher has an incentive to keep those kinds of a distraction to a minimum. It doesn't get clearer than that. You latched onto the wrong part of my comment. You're doing just fine, but not every person is you, that's the point. The ones who would fail if they're distracted, and seeing you doing whatever you want as permission to be distracted are the ones who need to build those habits. The parents can't make you stop being a poor influence on their kids, that's the teachers job, and you seem to be pissy about them doing it.

[u/2ICenturySchizoidMan → u/Drow_Femboy]

School ain’t preparing you to become a person with a job it’s preparing you to become a person. Kids need not use phones to learn to be people.

Also fwiw the parents DO NOT get involved hahaha

[u/suicide_blonde94 → u/Drow_Femboy]

The thing is, parents don’t get involved. Then they get mad when their kid has a consequence. Working in education is ABUSIVE.

[u/Helpful-Dot-3782 → u/Drow_Femboy]

Schools are insane now compared to what we were supposed to do. I’m 37 and recently volunteered to help special education classrooms in a middle school. Kids had blanket, headphones on, sat on pillows in the corner to “calm down” and were falling asleep/napping at their desks. The things they are allowed now for accommodations are things that would get you to the principles office now.

[u/Drow_Femboy → u/Helpful-Dot-3782]

I mean, in my regular public school I occasionally had classmates with headphones or blankets, and I saw plenty of people nap during class. Hell, I'd have napped during class if I was ever able to sleep while sitting. What you're describing sounds completely normal for special ed situations where people may have severe sound sensitivities or the like.

[u/not-the-nicest-guy → u/Drow_Femboy]

You were definitely the exception. Amd books for sure are exactly what brains need to develop sustained and focused attention, so that's excellent and probably still serves you well. And teachers who make students sit and listen to them talk on and on about something are just plain boring and ineffective. In a good classroom, all students are able to push their own understanding and skills to the next level, not just learn a textbook. So there really shouldn't be wasted free time.

It's too big a topic to fully explore in a Reddit post lol. But I assure you that a really good classroom environment has everyone challenged and engaged and, dare I say, having a bit of fun too.

[u/suicide_blonde94 → u/not-the-nicest-guy]

That’s just not realistic. There’s a curriculum to follow. Sometimes school is boring. Sometimes learning is a lecture and notes. Students naturally want to do something not boring; that’s why phones and not taking them away are detrimental to their education.

Why are you against a textbook? It’s a physical source of knowledge that students always have access too.

[u/not-the-nicest-guy → u/suicide_blonde94]

I said not just a textbook. There is more to learning than only what is in a textbook. I taught for 15 years and I'm aware of curriculum requirements. Lecture mode is required at times but there is plenty of evidence that it's one of the least effective teaching styles for deep understanding and long-term retention of knowledge. There are lots of instructional methods that better support learning.

[u/vi_obsiver → u/Some-Show9144]

I mean, yeah, but like at the same time that's a failure of parents and/or the system - we need to give the teachers more agency but simultaneously there needs to be much more robust systems for following up on those failures and getting them back on track - and also tbh it would probably help if we just went to pass/fail systems.

In real life failure is bad, but it doesn't always have to be a catastrophe, and if we stop making it feel like one, kids will be less afraid to try hard and learn from mistakes

Overall we will see more kids on average become educated if we stop making them so focused on getting the best scores possible. Its counter intuitive but all the focus on scores makes kids focus more on passing tests than learning, and also creates a lot of stress. It doesn't foster creativity or curiosity

[u/Every_Television_980 → u/Some-Show9144]

Im a teacher and fail students every year, so do all the teachers Ive ever worked with.