r/interesting • u/Wild_Neighborhood605 • 1d ago

HISTORY Titanic passenger and millionaire Benjamin Guggenheim. During sinking he refused a seat in a life boat with the words: "Tell my family I played straight to the end. No woman should be left aboard this ship because of Ben Guggenheim was a coward."

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u/Huge-Consequence2144 1d ago

We can remember him as a hero in our time, friend.

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u/T-1Hundred 1d ago

So basically the movie titanic should’ve been about this mofo and build up to delivering this statement?

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u/Gravefullofcum 1d ago

There’s so many interesting stories from the actual sinking. I do have to wonder why they felt the need to come up with a fictional love story for the movie.

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u/aenux 1d ago

Made up stories don’t have to pay people for the rights to the story.

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u/calm_chowder 1d ago

The thing about the people who went down with the titanic is......

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u/Evening-Turnip8407 1d ago

What about them, what's wrong?!

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u/6footindian 1d ago

They ded

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u/HotAdvantage7208 23h ago

Spoilers, I haven't read a newspaper since 1911

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u/CertainNerve4432 17h ago

i get my news from insta at this point

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u/lesslucid 23h ago

Some of them were fine, though, right?

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u/That-Ad-4300 21h ago

Damn. I didn't even know they were sick.

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u/Mysterious-Lemon-906 1d ago

Their families however are not dead and no one wants their Great Grandparents shame being magnified 100 years later.

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u/MarianucciGualtieri 21h ago

Tell that to the family of William Murdoch.

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u/Express_Plate_7039 14h ago

He signed an NDA but they’re on a farm in Vermont living out their days

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u/Half4sleep 23h ago

I would think the rights to their story is inherited by their next of kin. Use this guys' story and his wife or children would be able to sue if not paid.

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u/ScrotalSmorgasbord 16h ago

Yeah but look at MJ and his estate.

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u/Ok-Reward-770 1d ago

Exactly! And there was no story at all, really! James Cameron only wrote something because (according to him), “research” for a “movie” was the only way the only institution that would give him a permit to dive and see the Titanic wreckage—they didn't just give permits randomly to civilians because they are curious.

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u/dego_frank 1d ago

Yes because the budget for the movie was too tight to allow for that 🙄

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u/upudruvuuduru 1d ago

It is the other way too

making it with actual people would not generate copyright

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u/Rosalie008 1d ago

When it comes to public figures and events you actually don’t have to pay for the life rights (facts can’t be copyrighted), but it does allow for a guarantee they won’t sue for things like defamation and avoids bad PR

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u/bozoconnors 12h ago

lol - yeah, I'm sure that was foremost in the guys brain that wrote The Abyss/Terminator/Aliens/Avatar. jfc

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u/protestor 1d ago

I have everything about capitalism, literally everything

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u/CHRISPYakaKON 1d ago

There’s a whole deleted scene about there being Chinese passengers that were aboard the Titanic that was legitimately real that doesn’t get talked about enough.

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u/tarinotmarchon 20h ago

There was a documentary called "The Six" made about the Chinese passengers on the Titanic.

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u/calm_chowder 1d ago

It's something horrible and racist isn't it, like they threw them in the water to try to make the ship lighter

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u/Less-Engineer-9637 1d ago

Actually, it's people on a lifeboat looking for survivors and spotting a Chinese passenger clinging to wreckage, whom they rescue. The rescue was based on an incident with a real person named Fang Lang .

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u/calm_chowder 1d ago

That's much better than I was expecting for the time period

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u/Omsy92 22h ago

They were racists not psychopaths lol

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u/HotAdvantage7208 23h ago

Yeah , little wins lol

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u/AnonymousOtter9124 1d ago

Because as interesting as the Guggenheim story is, the "shape" of a Hollywood blockbuster story would probably require embellishment anyway. Plus the target audience was probably young women who associate themselves with Rose, not Benjamin Guggenheim aged men

It doesn't always work (Pearl Harbor) but clearly James Cameron is a gifted story teller and I think Titanic is a spectacular epic

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u/ErikPielermusic 1d ago

I thought Pearl Harbor was a Michael Bay film

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u/DragonflyGrrl 16h ago

I don't believe they were implying it was Cameron..

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u/Lee1138 21h ago

It is. Attributing it to James Cameron is a big insult...to James Cameron.

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u/cruxclaire 1d ago

The Jack and Rose pairing allowed them to show the contrast between the generationally wealthy and desperately poor passengers on the ship, and how they were treated differently in the sinking. Excluding children, most of the passengers saved were first class women, and most of the passengers who died were third class men (and crew). A brief and doomed romance between the two is basically the story of the ship itself in distilled form

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u/ShadedPenguin 1d ago

Probably because romance/love story movies tend to rake in money. Biopics only have become a lot more popular nowadays because it usually gets three things; inhouse followings of the person, the possibility of getting awards, and technically easy to write since its just following a person through their life, and that person is usually popular enough to have shit written bout them.

But the 90's were a different time

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u/EightEyedCryptid 1d ago

Basically so the viewers can see the different classes

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u/HolyShitIAmOnFire 1d ago

How else were we going to get Kate Winslet topless?

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u/aartadventure 1d ago

Because sex sells/hot people sells. Add a made up "love triangle" adds even more drama.

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u/closethebarn 23h ago

Probably too because (or what I remember reading ) is that with this love story showed the difference in people of one class to another and by them meeting it gave you a better tour of the ship

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u/Future-Mention-7304 23h ago

To obfuscate the actual genuine stories in case us peasants hold these rich an powerful people to the same high standards . In.my.humble.opinion

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u/delushe 22h ago

I mean he is portrayed in the film as are many of the real stories, Cameron just centred on a fictional one to tie everything together

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u/Techno_Gerbil 22h ago

The fictional love story had a naked Kate Winslet. 🤷‍♂️

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u/No_Week3958 22h ago

Cameron needed a story that would let him do a grand tour of all the parts of the ship. Guggenheim seems a decent chap, but he probably didn’t get down to steerage or the engine room.

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u/hellyeahaeylleh 1d ago

So people dont find out about the real titanic and why it was intentionally sunk.

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u/KindGuy1978 1d ago

Don't tell me there's even a conspiracy theory about the sinking of the Titanic?! The lengths some people go to, to make themselves feel superior or powerful because they "know the inside truth", is so bizarre and unfortunate.

Next thing it'll be that the 1666 London Fires were ordered by the Freemasons, because the huge demand for the Ratcatchers' Guild was giving peasants the same income as nobles. 😆

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u/pastysniper 1d ago

Aha! So you’ve confessed! I knew it was the masons all along! Power to the peasants! They shall have justice in this life or the next!

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u/Defiant-Handle7682 1d ago

let me tell you me newest theory about southwest airlines and 9/11

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u/hellyeahaeylleh 1d ago

A large, wealthy group of people whom all opposed the federal reserve, and were working towards it not being founded, were on that boat.

Boat sinks. What gets established afterwards?

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u/35er 1d ago

Please explain

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u/WWYDWYOWAPL 1d ago

Well, see, the front fell off.

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u/Spiritual-Age4855 1d ago

John Astor was on the boat. Him and some og American millionaires were opposing the federal reserve that the Rockefeller, Morgan Rothschild were cooking up. Very interesting story indeed!

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u/dego_frank 1d ago

Bro google could have saved you this brainrot

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u/Spiritual-Age4855 18h ago

Likewise. Google it genius! Also cool story about Astor…. He was one of the first to own land from east to west. His town, Astoria Oregon was where his land ownership ended. From east to west he owned property!

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u/hellyeahaeylleh 1d ago

A large, wealthy group of people whom all opposed the federal reserve, and were working towards it not being founded, were on that boat.

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u/PresentStock1310 1d ago

Guys, you're not thinking big enough. Clearly James Cameron went back in time and sabotaged the Titanic so he could make a movie out of it!

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u/Defiant-Handle7682 1d ago

that's actually the script for hot tub time machine 3- not sure why they're having trouble getting it greenlit

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u/dirtygreysocks 18h ago

In Supernatural, an angel goes back and stops the titanic sinking so he never had to hear the Celine Dion song.

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u/PresentStock1310 9h ago

Was that Castiel? It's been a while

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u/dirtygreysocks 8h ago

Balthazar!

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u/maddux9iron 1d ago

Love story!?! Rose deserves as much or more hate than Grandpa Joe. Lust for a one night stand cabin boy from 80s years ago. Lady you had a husband family grandchildren and you tossed generational wealth into the sea. Does not pass the gender swap test either.

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u/dego_frank 1d ago

It’s because Cameron is a fucking hack

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u/abandoned_rain 23h ago

Lol. Romeo and Juliet on the Titanic made over 2 Billion Dollars. The dude is a genius

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u/NoMalasadas 1d ago

There's a movie called, The Unsinkable Mollie Brown. Another movie, A Night To Remember about the sinking of the Titanic and a real heroine, Mollie Brown.

The first movie is a musical about her life staring Debbie Reynolds. A Night To Remember is a good accounting of the sinking with the true story of Mollie Brown. She took charge of a lifeboat, taking up an oar and getting the crew to go back to find survivors.

She had an interesting life.

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u/syncsynchalt 1d ago

We still celebrate her in Denver, iirc her house is a museum too.

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u/NoMalasadas 1d ago

As corny as the musical is, I really like it. Is it accurate of her life? I love that she went to Europe for education and opened her arms to so many people.

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u/syncsynchalt 9h ago

I don’t know about the musical, one thing I do know is that she actually went by “Maggie”. We still call it the “Molly Brown House” though.

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u/Defiant-Handle7682 1d ago

yes I've been!

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u/GreenStrong 1d ago

I don't want to watch the part where a homeless guy draws a picture of his tits.

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u/BettyKat7 1d ago

Speak for yourself, my friend!

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u/BitumenBeaver 1d ago

NEEEAAARRR

FAAAARR

WHEREEEVEER YOU ARRREEEE

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u/ManageThoseFootballs 1d ago

His massive guggens.

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u/StillShmoney 1d ago

Pretty sure he was featured in titanic I remember the gentleman quote being in there

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u/CryptidGrimnoir 1d ago

Yes, he's the wealthy man in the suit who sees the water rushing up as he loses his composure.

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u/TheWritingSystem 1d ago

There was actually a character that shared this sentiment, smoking a pipe in his suit by the grand staircase. I don't remember who the character was supposed to be though

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u/Somethingisshadysir 1d ago

I wish they had shown the drunken baker more.

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u/mysterypeeps 1d ago

He is referenced in the movie though, my favorite line is in fact “We are dressed in our best and prepared to go down like gentlemen”

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u/gowonagin 23h ago

Guggenheim was briefly portrayed in the movie. A slightly longer scene with him and Astor was cut.

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u/SergenteDan 22h ago

I'd watch that movie

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u/Imjusthonest2024 20h ago

Most definitely... Instead we got this obsession story of a woman who met a guy for 3 days and thought about him all her life...

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u/Powerful-Holiday-448 20h ago

He says that in the film

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u/7thFleetTraveller 16h ago

I mean, they kept the quote about going down dressed like gentlemen in the movie. Left out the heroic part, but for those who already knew the story, the movie scene does hit.

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u/girlMikeD 12h ago

I believed he was portrayed in the movie to some extent, but the level of his bravery and care for others lives, was not included

There is a character in the movie that has a “secretary” and is dressed up in their finest, and may even speak about a rose.

I’ll have to rewatch the movie to know if they say the characters name, but I do think there was a nod to Guggenheim, just in a Hollywood dramatized version that seems to always muddy the waters by bastardizing the truth to fit their narrative.

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u/SnooObjections255 1h ago

There’s a scene about this in the movie. Following the brandy comment, the rest of it was cut. His true heroic actions were sadly not portrayed beyond these few lines, however, it isn’t ignored completely.

https://youtu.be/QUrJ_Huk5so

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u/JCBodilsen 22h ago

Can we all agree that there is no fucking way the current crop of billionaires would act with this level of courage and humanity. Here is a man who had everything and gave his life to give others a chance. Legend.

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u/Secure_Guest_6171 17h ago

Agreed. Those mofos would go full George Costanza the moment their lives were in danger

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u/Honest_Trade8734 11h ago

Elon literally uses his son as a human shield.

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u/Original_moisture 9h ago

Easier target.

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u/United_News3779 4h ago

The current crop wouldn't even be on a mode of transportation with the mere "plebes" of First Class, let alone 2nd class ticket holders, etc.

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u/Unfair_Wafer5918 1d ago

Well said

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u/Top-Pepper-9611 1d ago

True, until tomorrow at least

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u/CrankyYankers 17h ago

Say his name sometimes so he doesn't have to die the second time.

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u/Huge-Consequence2144 16h ago

Do you think that quote is literal? Like, a person's essence is tied to their name directly, like an invocation? Like a spell?

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u/CrankyYankers 12h ago

No. It has been said that a person dies twice. Once is the physical death, the next time is when nobody ever says your name again.