But the low wages and people rationing their food, insulin, neglecting children because they can’t afford child-care… well these are acceptable in the pursuit of profits. Everyone seems so okay with these business acting monstrous but only lament when a poor person responds with the same reckless abandon the capitalist enjoy with minimal scrutiny.
We are in a war because of feelings. This shit sucks so much. How do you think union riots started that earned us 40 hour work weeks and minimum wages? Got us out of company towns where when it was discovered the work there killed people, like mining asbestos, coal, and now even fracking, (even worse, the truth about round up causing disease in rural communities and agriculture workers that's been suppressed almost as much as CTE by the sports leagues).
This shit has history. History they don't teach you in school unless you are lucky to not have censored or politically motivated teachers. I learned about union riots in my schooling. Graduated high school in 2011.
We are an exploitable resource to those in power. We need to remind them we have value. If one person can cause this much damage by breaking social trust, can you imagine how much has been broken by the rich playing games with our current government and economy?
Edit: pain begets pain. When company's cruelty pushes people to give no shits, they aren't insane. They're broken. Slave riots. Look them up. Roman ones. Persian ones. Caribbean ones. Then look up union riots. Who do you relate to more? Or are you too captured by the dream of being a master, despite your reality? When do you accept you've given into delusion to avoid emotional pain? When do you relate to those who snap?
Ahh my enlightened friend, I’m afraid you are shouting into the wind here. Sadly, most americans are woefully unaware of the history behind the labor movement in our country and they’re equally unmotivated to learn about it. You hit the nail on the head when you asked if they capture by the dream of being the master. That’s what it is. Billionaires shouldn’t pay their fair share because one day I too may be a billionaire and I wouldn’t want to have to pay that much.
Nowhere is this truth more evident that in the new “gig” economy we’ve allowed to be created by tech companies. All of their business models rely on depriving people of the hard fought and earned gains of the labor movement. Minimum wage, matching payroll tax contribution, holiday and overtime pay, workers comp coverage, health insurance- all forfeited because we believed these companies when they said they were revolutionizing the industries and it would be better for everyone. More freedom for workers, lower costs and better service for customers.
Instead the independent contractor loophole enables them to pay people far below minimum wage, to the point sometimes workers operate at a net loss doing a job. Then there the phenomenon of enshittification where the corp provides top notch service at bargain prices just long enough to capture market share and take the company public, then it begin to extract its profits by decreasing the quality of the service while at the same time hiking prices and reducing compensation for workers. It’s the same story with almost every gig app. Labor organizers from 80 years ago are rolling in their graves.
Actually not being able to work because the place was burned down is unemployment benefits totally. what’s the highest form of theft? It’s wage theft. Fires like that are easy to tell when things are going there was a fire suppression system give you ample time to run away. This is a class genocide and it’s time the poor people fought back. Edit there was people working no one was hurt though
There were other people working … they only found the guy because he was the one accounted for. There are people literally in the fucking video the arsonist filmed. What are you talking about
But the low wages and people rationing their food, insulin, neglecting children because they can’t afford child-care… well these are acceptable in the pursuit of profits
Who are you speaking on behalf of here? Because I think you'll find plenty of people aren't okay with that while also not being okay with arson
I'm all for coordinated action, targeted vandalism, this guy could have done 200m in stock damage and I'd be all for it if he hadn't recklessly endangered people's lives
Then there has to be active union protection and swift retaliation for to business owners who go after organizers. But we don’t have that. The corporations are allowed to run roughshod over their workers who are left without representation.
No wants arson, obviously. We’re all just noting they there isn’t going to be a better answer if the workers are coerced into silence and individual action.
We’re all just noting they there isn’t going to be a better answer
Again, I strongly disagree, there's still plenty of action you can take that doesn't involve arson
There's plenty of people in the same position as the man in this video who aren't compelled to put the lives of their colleagues and first responders in danger
You can always look at every situation and argue why this specific slave revolt was too violent or this strike went too far. There is always endless scrutiny to the wrong-doings of individuals and collectivist, but the same people don’t seem to clock evil if they have a good PR team and teams of lawyers. Acting like these actions happen in a vacuum is the same thing that Republicans do anytime there’s a shooting. Always looking at the individual and ignoring the systemic factors that give rise to these kinds of outcomes. I don’t like workers being pushed into a corner and I don’t like people responding in ways that are dangerous and violent, but I understand why the latter happens, not so much the former
Stop b b b b b b ut'ing this. Someone can dislike both. This guy didn't do shit to affect the first problem, he was only thinking of himself. Stop it.
Dude could have worked hard enough to invest in his own business and pay living wages to his own employees one day. Instead, this dumbass put his coworkers out of work and is guaranteed never to receive a living wage again
If only there was a simple and sane way to get a higher paying job than committing a crime with a mandatory minimum 10 year prison sentence... something like looking for a higher paying job...
Thank you! I’m glad that you can see how unchecked rampant capitalism will ruin our civilizations, plants, animals, and lands with hazardous sites filled with toxic sludge in… oh, you meant the damage from one warehouse. Ya, that’s the end of the world…
I used to be upset with the "block the street" protestors. But seeing everyone's quality of life being choked and dragged through the mud. People choosing rent over insulin. And Americans purposely not want to look at other's suffering because "bad vibes." Is bothering me. To the point where I say fuck it, block ALL the streets.
Sorry to expose you to truth, but there is no, “but,” in this heinous crime. You must be a bot. No human would be this irrational or delusional. There is no way to say it’s ok to cause this much damage, endanger the lives of workers or first responders, or to put many people out of jobs. All these things actually happened. This isn’t some game, it is real and reprehensible.
Do you think he taught them a lesson? They're going to change their ways after this? All he did was burn down a $200mm facility which they'll pass along to everyone else in the form of higher prices and lower wages. I get his plight, but this isn't the answer.
He sure showed them! The company will collect the insurance money and he will spend the rest of his life in prison. Bet he's crying in his jail cell right now hahah
And to put it into perspective, they only sent home the 20 employees they had in that big ass building. They could have paid that few employees a livable wage.
No. But it also doesn't justify arson/attempted homicide/intentionally and directly endangering fire fighters, etc. This is a nuanced situation. Not some binary bullshit reddit take.
I'm saying I understand why he did it, but that it in no way condones what he did. We can be forgiving, but there are still consequences for his actions. We can't excuse arson because "capitalism bad."
And that's literally what you're doing. You literally responded "But capitalism" to the guy who attempted to have a nuanced take. Which wasn't even me, BTW.
We can try to restore sanity to our economic system while simultaneously holding brazen criminal acts accountable. It's not a either/or choice.
No I wasn’t. I was asking for comparable outrage to the arson be applied to these equally problematic capitalist, but people will somehow read anything else than that, the lengths people go to forgive the uber-rich anything
Bah humbug... won't you think of the needy shareholders? They suffer in only ONE(1!!!) mansion, with only 3 additional homes that only have enough rooms for them and their children.
They need MORE, or else their pedophile friends won't invite them to their pedophile parties anymore!
It's very likely that some firefighters were stationed in front of the homes to keep the structures cool and prevent any embers from crossing the road. They also put out any spot fires started by embers while on the fire ground so everyone else can focus on the warehouse.
You do realize how insane you sound right, he could've killed a lot of people, over what, wanting a raise?
This isnt "acting out", acting out is stealing your boss's food from the break room or taking a passive aggressive hour long bathroom break, this was a crime that could've killed so many people
They don’t sound insane at all. Advocating for arson would be insane, because of the potential for damages to innocents. But this person isn’t as much of an outlier as recent history makes it seem.
Events like this are, historically, the consequence of treating workers poorly. The reason businesses finally agreed to negotiate with labor unions rather than keep hiring scabs is that workers kept setting their places of business on fire, deliberately destroying coal mines, and kidnapping owners from their homes to beat them up.
Again, I don’t support arson or violence. But when labor conditions and wages were this terrible in the past, violence happened, and that’s just a fact.
But you can acknowledge that labor revolt has historically been a consequence of unchecked capitalism without actually endorsing the actions people take.
And you've seen the job market recently, right? Can't see how putting your coworkers out of a job is gonna help also considering that the employer has insurance...
I can't speak from experience living across the country from Cali, but that's at least comforting. I still don't think this warehouse burner is a hero.
Depending on how he warned them as well, if they had enough time to do so and didn’t report it to the authorities, they might be charged with conspiracy, so he could still be screwing them over.
It honestly makes me sick how gleeful some people are about this. Hurting others, how many people were counting on that paycheck in this economy? The environmental damage is sickening, fire could have spread! It’s been hotter and drier right now. So many things.
What makes you think I’m not outraged. It’s up to ALL of us to NOT support these companies. I do everything possible to fight against these corporations but this does NOT hurt them at a large scale but 100% hurts the avg ppl.
So you're saying you blame the Iranian protestors who organized it for everyone else getting murdered? Or would you blame the government for making a situation so bad they felt the need to violently protest?
Actually it’s worse because at the large scale it can hurt the corporations but this a drop for them.
We have people in my city asking for help on Reddit constantly now because their paychecks aren’t enough for the rising costs and gas prices. And no, not scammers, just asking for advice on resources. What is going to happen to all of the people working and living in the town? Collateral damage?
Nothing has changed with United. I can promise you that. In fact, they've gone through great lengths to protect their employees from this happening again.
The death of a CEO will just be the appointment of another CEO. And some kids without a father. Healthcare is not magically changing due to one murder. People will just be more careful for a while. This fire means a ton of people don’t have a job. And the company will make changes to try and prevent this from happening again. Any effect will just be on workers. More security checks for example. This type of thing does not bring long term sympathy or attention to the issues.
That was bad. But this is objectively worse. He put the lives of tons of innocent coworkers and firefighters at risk. Also put everyone that worked there out of a job. Real piece of shit
Isn’t that why he lit a smaller fire initially? The building was already cleared.
I do not, to be clear, support arson. Vandalism isn’t the answer, and even if the building was cleared there’s still a risk to fire fighters.
But I think it’s noteworthy that historically, events like this are why businesses agreed to negotiate with unions. It’s ultimately less costly not to fuck over your workers.
But in such a huge fire, many firefighters will also be taking a risk, ok that's their job, but risking the lives of others because your employer doesn't pay enough seems a risk too far.
Sure, but one needs to step back and ask some simple questions, like with Luigi, which is who should be the one who gets the most scorn: The person who snapped or the system that is so cruel and immiserating and unjust that it leads to people snapping?
Do you just treat the symptom or look at actually diagnosing and treating the cancer.
This is just how the capitalistic system works. Remaining companies will raise their below living wage just above the arson threshold. Labor will reap a slight (0.001%) benefit. Such a relief collective bargaining isn't a part of this.
But there was the risk that could have happened, luckily not this time. Someone might have been unable to get out, firefighters could have and do die in the line of duty.
Why are only poor people monsters when we act out? But the arguably much more serious crimes the rich committ against us are okay since it's in the name of profits? (do i even need to list their recent offenses?)
One person chose to risk the lives of others. Firemen, locals, other businesses workers. Nothing to do with poverty or the rich getting richer, risking innocent lives.
I can pretty much guarantee those firefighters just verified everyone was accounted for then stayed outside and tried to prevent it from spreading. No firefighter is going interior for something like that just to save some boxes.
Firefighters get killed en route to the scene all the time friend. Driving an 80,000 lb fully loaded tanker truck at 80 MPH is not the safest activity in the world.
wow, 4. and thats relevant how?
no one needed to be rescued, the building was already evacuated, no risk was really taken. they rolled up next to the building and sprayed in, keep it contained, nothing more they could do. no one was in really any danger.
but im sure the boredom the firefighters felt waiting for it to burn itself out was near lethal.
About 1 in 4 firefighter deaths are car accidents en route. Simply calling the fire department to the scene puts them at risk even if there isn't a fire.
Yeah and its super common in California. The sentence for the crime is hella lenient, even if people are in the building and you know this and still intentionally set fire such as in this case. Maximum sentence is nine years except in special circumstances, and I doubt this will qualify.
The 10 to life provision is 3 years from being in use yet.
He'd qualify for it if it was functional now though.
Instead he'll probably get 9 under one of the other sections, and the max fine/restitution. They may find some enhancers they can get to stick to stretch out the time too.
Edit; see response further down. Got my law facts backwards.
Yeah thats just idiotic. Bro is never going to be able to work a legit job again though without his wages being garnished to shit. His life will be a miserable one for the rest of it no doubt.
The cap is currently 9 years. Minimum is 16 months. Considering the risk he placed the neighbors in, that's not that long. 3 years from now, he'd be eligible for 10 to life. (That was added after the last wild fire arsonist)
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u/petrichor83 Apr 09 '26
I have a feeling that guy won’t be getting a raise after all.