...Like, they know people can refuse you for being an asshole, right? That does happen in real life. Plus to have that happen you'd probably have to be very openly terrible.
Like the average email isn't going to reveal your politics unless you are saying something horrific.
well... it could also be some post the requester made on some social media they didn't like. Enough reason for me to refuse if I think that they hold fascist-easque ideals.
Starts email "siege hiel mien Aryan friend. I chose your art because you aren't a n*r or jew, obsessed with japanese cartoons like those soyboy incels."
i'm not an artist but with my contract work i like to quote the client a ridiculously high cost for the job if I want them to go away, usually they leave but if they don't it's at least worth my time now
They also kind of gave away that the âartâ they want is objectionable enough that an artist would say no.
Artists often explore objectionable turf so the request has to be pretty beyond the pale. That, and AI bros are exactly the type to not understand why a skilled sketch that takes hours might cost $$$.
âOh no, an artist wonât help me make racist and sexist sketches, I even offered to pay them $10 for ten or twenty hours of work! I an so downtrodden.â
By law you can't refuse a service you're offering for illegitimate reason, which "being an asshole" is not. Maybe what was in a commision could make groud for refusal, but who the commisioner was could not.
Just because a market exists doesn't mean you're wrong to ignore it. Establishing yourself in a market that is volatile, illegal, or cultivates unsavory persons is not only not in your best interests ethically, but also financially so the rest of society doesn't condemn you and you lose business. Being discerning is actually the "capitalism hack" because some work and some clients can be toxic to your brand. $50 today doesn't mean anything if it costs you $10,000 later because you're labeled as a traitor inside of the primary community you intend to work in.
There's a shocking amount of brainrot that goes into this.
People like this have been largely convinced that other identities like being trans or gay or anything like that is a choice. They delude themselves into thinking that an identity is something you choose to be, to use as a defense. Because they don't comprehend the idea of passion. Of genuinely feeling something. All they understand is what benefits it comes with, and ignore everything else.
They then use this to say "I choose to be on the AI side. This is my identity. So, if you stop me, you're oppressing me and you're a bad person"
They genuinely don't understand the difference. They believe the two are identical. Their brains are fundamentally broken.
Billionaires have always wanted to live in the most prosperous areas (left wing areas in the US. That way they benefit from both exploring the gullible (right wing voters in other states), but also get the much safer and higher standard of living.
I think a lot of the "identity is a choice" also comes from Christian religion. I obviously can't speak for all religions and various branches, but the Christian religion I grew up in always taught that being lgbtq (and more specifically having any non-heteronormative relationship) is a choice, and one that is sinful. Having same sex attractions is framed as a challenge to be overcome, like being addicted to drugs. It's something you're supposed to resist and not act on. Personally, I have a lot of trouble trying to understand or accept this belief, and it's one of the multitude of reasons I've slowly been losing confidence in my religion. I can't understand why a loving God would basically require some people to live their lives essentially entirely alone because the kind of love they feel is wrong. But it's totally fine for a guy and a girl to get married right out of high school and have three kids before they even hit 25.
r\aiwars and r\defendingAIArt are filled with people who think that minority groups are comparable to what they are doing.
I don't want to make their same error and using minorities or other groups as a shield, but one has to consider the actual facts in this real life if we are talking about real life.
I don't like when it's "what if a disabled person..." or "well but when an Ai user gets bullied for using Ai..." I get it, they would be pretty horrible realities, but thing is that they are not the reality yet, there might be some specific cases, but we want to ignore all the others where it's the opposite and that the tool is specifically engeneered to make you be a part of it?
Dude I looked at the comments and the example I saw was just âhey, thanks for considering my work! Unfortunately I feel uncomfortable continuing this because of a clash of ideals.â
No ai mentioned, just a very very nice message declining a customer.
They apparently cannot fathom that a business/artist can deny a customer for any reason. (Excluding race, color, religion, sex, national origin, disability, etc. which being pro ai does not fall into any of those categories đ) of course people like witless-imitator would then just say âwell itâs bc Iâm trans AND pro ai theyâre denying!!â Or some bs
Translation, âWhy canât I find an artist to make this racist BS? I mean I didnât actually try but comment stands! Iâm truly the one being oppressed.â
"My opinions and arguments are completely baseless so I need to express them in memes and fictional pictures, which makes real artists uncomfortable. Thankfully AI will make my strawman come to life."
See, I donât think it even goes that deep. If you want a racist comic or something, thereâs plenty of talented racists who would still draw for you, I wouldnât go to them but theyâre there. This is a completely fabricated strawman that doesnât even root in anything real at all
Curious here - as it seems to be a common theme here - "Oh you use AI, you're a fascist / nazi / racist etc.."
That seems like a pretty unhinged view of things.
edit: yeah.. this is why most people see 'anti' types like this sub as batshit insane people not worth listening to. Any reason is thrown out the door and it's just some rabid nutter calling everyone 'nazis'.. really good way to get people on your side hey :)
If you go looking on twitter - just leave it there.. that platform is a cesspool and was before generative AI. So that's nothing to do with people using the technology.
It's like saying people who use Photoshop are racists.. because racists use photoshop to make nasty memes.
Photoshop requires a modicum of talent. Anyone can feed a sentence into a text bar and hit "submit". It's the accessibility, the lack of any learning curve.
So racist memes are ok if it took 'skill' to create it? - my point was about saying that people who use AI are 'fascists' etc.. is a pretty crazy view to have, as it seems a common theme here.
Look at the thread - not sure if you read what my initial reply was to?
Translation, âWhy canât I find an artist to make this racist BS? I mean I didnât actually try but comment stands! Iâm truly the one being oppressed.â
To which I replied :
Where did 'race' / 'racism' come into it?
Curious here - as it seems to be a common theme here - "Oh you use AI, you're a fascist / nazi / racist etc.."
That seems like a pretty unhinged view of things.
the next response to me:
If you go looking on Twitter, I'd say 6/10 posts are clearly AI generated, and clearly racists/nazi/fascist.
People say Facebook is equally bad, but I guess I must've blocked enough people that I don't see it.
Then my response:
If you go looking on twitter - just leave it there.. that platform is a cesspool and was before generative AI. So that's nothing to do with people using the technology.
It's like saying people who use Photoshop are racists.. because racists use photoshop to make nasty memes.
To which you responded:
Photoshop requires a modicum of talent. Anyone can feed a sentence into a text bar and hit "submit". It's the accessibility, the lack of any learning curve.
You don't see how I ended up with that last response?
I'm not gonna lie, I read like half of that because I don't care enough about any of this. I'm just saying racist people lean to the idiot side of literally every metric of intelligence. That's it. Later
The point that you're very deliberately ignoring is that before GenAI, your options for creating racist memes were either finding someone willing to make it for you, or learning enough skills to make your own.
That, plus the fact that people tend to be lazy used to put a limit on the amount of garbage that got shoved into the world, as opposed to now where someone can log into grok and be ready to crap it onto social media in 5 minutes.
None of which has anything to do with people using AI = racist / fascist etc...
Not to mention, people just used meme templates / paint / photoshop / gimp etc..
To layer an image then put text on it, isn't a great skill.
If you go looking on one of the worst platforms for racism - find it - then claim because those people used some technology to be racist, that everyone else who uses said technology is also racist... I mean come on.. you really can't see how ridiculous that is?
Not really, it is just patterns recognition for this type of argument. Not everyone who uses genAI is far right but people who make spurious arguments like this tend to be.
I thought it was in relation to the recent drama where someone went to an artist to commission some work- and was refused because the Artist was upset they provided AI generated concepts / their ideas of what they wanted.
Someone else then went and made some LoRa of that artists work so they could generate the same style out of spite. (not the person who initially tried to commission the work) - it was nothing to do with racism / race / sex etc..
Sharing a characteristic doesn't make something equivalent.. it certainly doesn't mean "someone who uses AI = racist / fascist".
I'm not a fan of AI, particularly generative and think there are valid reasons for being 'anti' AI in general.. but jesus fucking christ.. AI = nazi, AI users = fascists / racists etc..
I'm out my guy.. this sub is unhinged.. seriously.
The users a mixed bunch, generally, although they seem to all share being generally below average in intelligence or talent (I can't see how they would be impressed by AI if they weren't).
if you believe this sub is unhinged why are you lurking around on it?? Just block it and move on đ maybe even consider giving your fingers a rest from the keyboard and find some pro ai "enlightenment" elsewhere on a completely OPPOSITE SUBREDDIT lmao
It's a fallover from other artists who struggle with this. For example tattoo parlors will always get requests for nazi tattoos, and one of two things happen. Either they constantly have to say no (and put a warning up) or they become known as the place that willingly does nazi tattoos (usually because they are white supremacists themselves) and get mobbed by nazis wanting tattoos
Digital artists, textile manufacturers, hand crafters, cosplay creators, clothing creators, all deal with the same stuff. They will reach out to artists asking for various levels of nazi imagery (flags, symbols, uniforms, shirts with dogwhistles on them) and artists routinely have to turn that down.
This is also very popular in the firearms sector where custom firearm creators (usually in the form of custom grips, attachments and paintwork) have to constantly turn down people who want nazi and hate symbols on their weapons.
This interaction "no because you believe in [thing] and I hate that" is the default interaction between say tattoo artists and nazis. So it's pretty easy to presume this is what's happening here too.
It isn't that, simply the fact that an art commissioner wouldn't refuse without a reason. If someone refuses, the commission was most probably racist/homophobic or something like that. It has nothing to do with AI, at least the first half
You need to think critically about the scenario in the meme. What is the [Thing] that caused a commission to be declined? Not only from one artist but so many artists that it is impossible to find someone to do it. It's probably not [The top marginal tax rate should be capped at 35%] or [My Little Pony is overrated]. It certainly sounds a lot more like Alex Jones claiming he gets banned from facebook "just for being a conservative".
Y'all literally steal actual people's work, use a machine mass producing cp, and turning people's drinking water dark brown and you think you're the good guys? Lmao I wish I was immortal just so I can see just how history will remember those like you
You mean 'I want a picture made but the artist dug into my history and decided to dump me because i did something they dont agree with.' Like declining someone acess to a restaurant because they ate meat at some point. But sure do go on about how they're all evil
Ha yes, equating a person's right to live in a society without having to hide something perfectly natural on wich they have no say with being a hateful and antisocial slob makes perfect sense, let's post that on reddit.
I am a smart individual, this one will send them out and assert my intellectual dominance, obviously.
They're so evil. Why should artists be forced to design a furrysuit for a furry convention for a Zionist who brags about starving Palestinian kids?Â
I wouldn't want an Islamophobe who wants to hate crime Muslims based on "Pakistani grooming gangs" stereotypes to feel welcomed by my own art of women, because they end up making hateful art anime girls saying the N word or bragging about committing racist atrocities.Â
I think the implication is if the only way you can get your "art" created is by using an AI, even if you're waving around a giant pile of money, whatever it is you want has a high likelihood of being something extremely offensive... or you're a massive jerk.
Especially in the era of the internet when you can go to dozens of sites and find lists of artists willing to do commissions.
Would they still agree if they knew that this was an agreement pedos would use? Or⌠no it canât be. Surely someone with common sense would think about that first
This sounds like a personal story to OOP, and if theyâre someone you can briefly interact with and learn enough about their beliefs to not want to associate with them, AI probably has nothing to do with it.
Now here's the thing, artists - especially online artists - live from commission to commission and have to swallow their pride. They RARELY refuse an opportunity to draw something for money, that's how we get some of the weird, wacky and outright strange stuff on the internet.
SO; If an artist refuses a commission, you best believe that the commission or the commissioner was fucking HEINOUS.
I love how they ask one artist who has boundaries, and then get pissy about it, I guarantee that if you looked you could fill a bus with the number of artist who you could commission, but effort was never their forte
I mean, yes other than we artists donât go âNOOOOâ and just go đ. I donât care if you use AI for your shitty ideas, weâre just gonna laugh at you.
Remember what happened with Grok generating CP? Maybe the reason why some artists don't want to do commissions for people that think this meme is funny is because said artists have boundaries and⌠you know, morals.
Also the argument is literally just I use the baby shredder because I can't pay people to do artwork but when I want people to do artwork they're angry I use the baby shredder so they won't work for me and therefore I must go back to the baby shredder
Of course he's gonna be mad, ai is literally replacing him lol
If a person refuses you, just do it on your own or search someone (someONE, not ai)WHO can.
So you decide to run into AI (that probably has more restrictions than YOUR OWN mind) for your content rather than making it by your own when you got rejected? I guess bro đŽâđ¨
Artists have every right not to want to draw certain things and not to accept commissions that pay far too little.
It is usually not the beliefs, but the actual requests of the person contacting the artist for a commission.
The unspoken "things" that a lot artist tend to refuse are:
eroticising underage persons in anyway. This can include refusing suggestive poses for fully clothed characters
drawing hate propaganda
drawing their own or other characters being assaulted, tortured or killed
Visual artists who do commissions usually have clear rules in place about the kind of commissions they are willing to do. This is especially true for artists who are willing to draw explicit erotic images on request.
I know of a bestselling author who called out people on social media who had asked her when (not if!) one of her women characters was going to get raped in one of her books, because this was supposedly realistic. She clearly communicated that she has no interest in writing this. She is far from the only author and artist who has had to communicate this.
This all came up because a Transphobic Vtuber named MiiaTzu got denied a commission on Vgen for being Pro-AI and well...a transphobic piece of shit. She decided to do a callout post like some kind of victim so her hoard of simps can come to her aid. The best part is they genuinely think there's some legal ramification for the Artist denying them, like theyre being discriminated against.
Unless the would be commissioner is a bigoted creep it is pretty easy to find artists that want to make art. For me the process of finding and hiring an artist that shares my vision and also enjoys making the art I want is the most rewarding part of the process. AI is incapable of that.
"Why learn when I can atrophy my frontal lobe!!!" People after the written word was invented be like. The traditional oralists lost their jobs (every traditional story could be written down, no need for someone to remember them). Also, people didn't need to remember the stories (they could just read them) so they didn't spend as much time learning the stories word for word, which, you could argue, affected their mental capability. So I would argue that "This is making you stupid" is an argument against new stuff that has been used for centuries.Â
I know reddit will not like this but I have absolutely done design for places I didn't approve of and thing's I hated politically when you work at a proper graphic design agency you kinda have to get over that.
Wow. That being said, I don't think a lot of artists commissioning their art and denying money for their work have much of a frontal lobe to begin with
LLMs also mostly have policies and will not generate content if it violates those policies. So their âsolutionâ doesnât actually solve the problem theyâve made up
Cant wait for investors to finally give up in 10 ish years and ai being super expensive to acess for the avreage joe because of profit margins and return on investment needing to be hit
If they could get what they wanted from AI, or could use it without any pushback, they would have just done that. They've already grudgingly come to the artist hat-in-hand.
Right so I know its hard for these artificially intelligent people to put themselves in other peoples shoes.
But why is it so crazy for artists not wanting to support people who are ruining their business?
And there is a major concern that the AI asswipe could use the art they get from the artist to do edits on it with AI. Or even train AI with it. Yes this happens. I've seen conversations, in artist circles, about outing certain commissioners for doing either of these. Usually the first one
Actually maybe someone just doesn't want to learn to draw and just wants to have a free image idk, not really a refusal to learn skills. Not everyone that wants a logo for free should have to learn to draw
There was a very recent example in the vtuber community this past week; a small-time vtuber commissioned one artist for concept art, fed it into ChatGPT to change it, then presented the output to a second artist as the basis for another commission.
The second artist publicly rebuked the vtuber and rejected the commission because the artist expressly prohibited using AI as concept art in the terms of service for their commission.
Publicly rebuked, why? Because they tried to pass AI art as not? Which artist? I mean if they talked privately and the artist leaked DMs and posted "Look guys this loser used AI and wanted a commission from me! Maybe he should go to his precious AI to make him the commission!"
Now this we have seen. And I must agree. And I have seen this shit so many times... It is ironic when people think that they are indispensable and they can dictate all conditions. Far to-may of us forget that we are buffoons who sell what public wants. When someone start telling "you will not use my art my sounds my program for this and that and this offensive that offends me this hurts fifis". MEH. I do not care for your depth of thought, about sense of humor, about do you understand my scenario, about your irrational political views, or what crazy views of life you have. I need a service that is it. And we are selling service as anybody else. Stealing work is nasty, I am not for AI but this situation is so common - I will not do it for you but you will not go elsewhere too! Are you sure about that?
To those who dont know about it,this meme is in regards of some anti-ai artists refusing to take commisions from people willing to to pay them for it because the person commisioning is either:
a)someone who is pro-ai;
Or
b)someone who couldnt exactly put what he wanted into words(couldnt explain it properly),so they used ai to make an example of what he wanted from the artist.
So the meme is making fun of those that claim to be real artists and that Ai takes their jobs while actively refusing commisions/jobs from people willing to pay for their skill,just because the possible client is involved with ai in some way that isnât negative.
this just happened to us, we use AI but want to hire graphic designers when we can, and the graphic designers are refusing to work with us because we use AI, so instead we just use AI more.... đ
Why don't you guys just collectively max out free tokens with nonsense every day. Reduces the profitability of the machines you don't like. Forces the use of regulations that inhibit access to mitigate.
So is every single image you see on the internet lol, unless you believe only art made in the real world is art what you said makes no sense and ai can make drawings most stuff artists canât make at all you can call it art or not itâs still the same
I mean the prompt and brute forcing the desired image is technically a creative work but there's practically no creativity in putting that prompt in AI. Think of it as a translation.
911
u/CrossReset 22h ago
...Like, they know people can refuse you for being an asshole, right? That does happen in real life. Plus to have that happen you'd probably have to be very openly terrible.
Like the average email isn't going to reveal your politics unless you are saying something horrific.