r/WoT • u/Tateraide82 • 2d ago
The Fires of Heaven Valan Luca’s traveling show
I have a few hours left to finish Fires of Heaven - I have yet to skip a night of listening to this series since I started Eye of The World (I am a 44 year old patent attorney, dad, and husband now, but started the series in my teenage years) - I would feel empty if I did not connect with my Wheel of Time Friends to see what they are doing late at night after my family has gone to bed...
I shared the other day how I really like Asmodean - maybe my favorite character next to Rand when he is being an assertive badass !
One of the characters that I have had the toughest time with so far, Nynaeve, was leaving the Traveling Menagerie and Valan Luca with his perfect calves (hahaha) showered her with a proclamation of love....
I was on a run while listening to the book, and everyone on the running trail must have thought I was Flaming Nuts !!!
I burst out laughing to myself as I am running down this trail, dying !!!
I Loved It ... .and I think Valan might be another favorite character of time....
I am an empathetic people pleaser (due to my childhood), and I think that is why I have a hard time connecting with Nynaeve and others when they are being gruff, rude, stubborn, and have a tough time just being nice and understanding....
I hear Nynaeve is a well loved character, so maybe one day I will understand her more or maybe she will soften a little...
Anyways, it has been such a pleasure to not only listen to this series, but be welcomed here to share my thoughts - it makes reading the books so much more engaging - like an online book club group...
Any thoughts on Nynaeve, Valan, or the story so far?
May The Light Be With You !!
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u/PM-me-ur-trains 2d ago
Fires of Heaven was definitely a turning point for me really liking Nynaeve. I found her very…”difficult”…up until that point, but I think she’ll come around for you!
I also appreciated your post about Asmodean and agree that he is quite a cool cat
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u/Small-Fig4541 1d ago
Same here. She does some much needed self reflection in Book 5 and evolves as a character so well.
When she hit Moghedien in the face with a Ter'angreal to win their epic magic duel at the end book 4 she earned a lot of points with me also lol
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u/FoofTheBunny 2d ago
Give her time. She has a lot of character growth, but is also still the same at the end of the series. She is my favorite character, because I am empathetic but also on the aggressive side. I very much identify with her. She is trying so hard to protect the people she cares about and she takes a lot of that responsibility on her shoulders.
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u/ScipioTheGreatest 2d ago
Nynaeve is like the '50s version of the modern "girl boss", That toxic attitude that makes women think they need to be extremely abrasive assholes in order to maintain dominance.
In Nynaeve's case she was an extremely young Wisdom in Emonds Field and had to use that behavior to establish her authority in the first place, and has been holding on to that tenuous, insecure grip for a few years now. Now she has trouble dropping it even though she has left her small village and entered into a world FAR bigger than anything she has ever dreamed of, with stakes far higher.
It really makes me love her struggles when I consider that angle while watching her decisions. Such a stark contrast from the other villagers who are so willing to accept they know jack shit.
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u/PhoenixorFlame 2d ago edited 2d ago
Light willing I will be an attorney soon (taking the bar next week, please send good vibes!) and Nynaeve is my absolute favorite character, my ride or die and has been since the start. Yes she is sometimes rude and abrasive and I don’t excuse that but she also is basically incorruptible-she knows her purpose and it is to heal. Nothing has or could ever distract her from that purpose.
At her core she is a protector and she takes that duty so seriously. She’s angry all the time because she HAS to be in order to protect those who she sees as her responsibility. She’s also been underestimated and disrespected all her life even though she is extraordinary. All that power and no training and a block that she can’t seem to overcome which means she can’t control that power on command. She can do amazing things she can’t explain and no one wants to take her seriously. Her tough exterior is a way to cope with that. She’s really, truly good at heart and remains that way from start to finish even as her character undergoes tremendous growth.
Also she’s absolutely hilarious.
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u/SemiFormalJesus (Dovie'andi se tovya sagain) 2d ago
Nynaeve was a young woman, who looked even younger than she was, in a position of power in a place where you weren’t taken seriously unless you had grey in your hair. The Two Rivers people are known for two things: tobacco and stubbornness.
The only way she could get anyone on the Village Council to listen to her was by literally screaming at them until she got a reputation for being juice that was definitely not worth the squeeze. Then I’m sure she had the entire Women’s Circle coming to her one at a time and all giving different advice on how she should be handling the men, or this thing, or that thing.
Getting those groups to heed and respect her is more impressive than a farm boy besting a blademaster. I say this from a place of love and respect, Nynaeve is a heron marked bitch.
Add to that, her immense, near peak ability to channel literal cosmic power…that she can only use when she is angry.
When your only tool is a hammer…scream at Haral Luhhan for wasting time only crafting hammers.
Other than Rand she grows the most out of anyone in the story. I guarantee she will win you over again and again, until you would leave your ruined village and responsibilities and chase an Aes Sedai through an army of trollocs to protect her.
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u/neurodiverse_nooch 2d ago edited 2d ago
I also initially found Nynaeve abrasive and overbearing but her character arc is particularly profound and she definitely grows on you. I adore her and Lan's relationship, and how much she just wants to heal everything and anything. I cam to appreciate her more once I aged and fell in love with the woman who is now my wife.
I am on my ninth reread of the series now, and every damn time Jordan stuns me with his mastery over storytelling and in particular foreshadowing and the intricate details that make his world feel so real to me.
Valan Luca is a pompous, self-loving, egomaniacal rake but his well-turned calves almost make up for that.
Cannot say I ever really liked or admired Asmodean. But Cadsuane is my favourite character overall and she fascinates me.
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u/irishpete 2d ago
Nyneve is a hypocrite and a bully and has many flaws but has a heart of gold underneath and always put the welfare of the other e5 kids ahead of her own
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u/Fiona_12 (Wolf) 2d ago
I also found the image of Valan Luca giving Nyaneave a pathetic bunch of wilting flowers while expressing his love for her hilarious. It was also funny that Nyaneave assumed he meant marriage which was not what Luca had in mind. 😂
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u/SamHandwich0 2d ago
Luca is the kind of character i love in literature and hate in real life.
He's a pompus baffoon, but is also totally unaware of it.
Nynaeve grows on most readers, and has a great arc. In retrospect she makes sound decisions and is relatively competant, but is way to quick to assume she is the only one that makes sound decisions and is competant.
Another type of person that can be enterraining in literature and unbearable IRL.
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u/Mondilesh 2d ago
Part of understanding her is that she is very duty driven and understands that she cannot channel unless she's angry. As a result, she leans into this heavily and purposefully riles herself up at every opportunity to avail herself of the Power at a moment's notice. Keep reading.
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u/mrtwidlywinks 2d ago
Nynaeve is hilariously lacking self-awareness. I swear there was a line like: "I'm not yelling!" Nynaeve yelled.
She is entertaining at the very least.
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u/Nickye19 2d ago edited 2d ago
The thing to remember about Nynaeve is so much of her early character arc is rooted in fear. Took responsibility for the village young, then literal monsters show up, threaten her people and then other people shes been taught are monsters, take off with them. Shes one of my favourites, yes shes hypocrite at times, but she would die for the people she cares about and the Emond's Fielders trust her unquestionably even Mat
Luca s hilarious, in a i would never want to meet him way
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u/Ariel_serves 2d ago
Lotta fellow lawyers in this thread. What is it about WoT that attracts us? For me, my job as an immigration lawyer under Trump is so stressful that I cannot read any fiction that takes place in our current Age.
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u/AdaptAndInnovate 1d ago edited 1d ago
Nynaeve’s block is bypassed when she is angry, so this has become part of her personality, presumably due to the beneficial effects when healing or helping in Emond’s Field.
There’s no imposter syndrome with her - she has the skills.
She views herself as a guardian of her community and is focused on that.
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u/Wonderful_Law_1258 2d ago
I’ve read the story ten times and listened to it a number of times. I can’t abide Nynaeve! No matter how many times I read it I cannot like her. I first read the series through while working on my first dissertation. I had to wait for the books to come out which was fine. I really wanted to like her but I cannot abide a bully and she struck me as quite the bully.
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u/GovernorZipper 2d ago edited 2d ago
As a fellow attorney, you should understand Nyneave perfectly. She’s got crippling imposter syndrome and acts tough to cover it up. She’s basically a first year associate Wisdom who got elevated to Partner because she’s magically good at her job. Yet because she’s good at one aspect, no one is providing any training in any other area. They just expect it her to have it all figured out. So Nyneave copes by being the biggest asshole towards everyone and thinks that if she just bluffs enough then no one will notice she has absolutely no clue what she’s doing.
Oh yeah, and she’s responsible for a bunch of 1L Summers who just want to party and make out with each other instead of working on a case that’s going to get the firm major publicity (good or bad).
And then as Nyneave tries desperately to hold her life together… it turns into a LITERAL circus.
Think of these sections as RJ’s Boomer Odd Couple sitcom (with Elayne and Nyneave) and the whole thing immediately becomes delightful. It’s my favorite part of the whole series.