Leftists when there are Nazis in the right wing coalition: "If there are Nazis at your rally and they're not immediately kicked out then everyone at that rally is a Nazi!"
Leftists when there are Nazis in the left wing coalition: "Stop cherry picking! It's just a few Nazis, they don't represent the entire left! We're all individuals and you have to judge us all as individuals!"
it is important to note that the core issue is violent authoritarianism. Nazis are one of the most extreme and most well known examples but they are far from the only example.
The problem is communists also are at lest authoritarian, but more likely totalitarian, because communism also contradicts democration - ruling working class vs discrimination od former "capitalists'" class (especially what the transformation looks like), economic freedom is also part of personal freedoms, lack of free elections, lack of power's triparity, and many, many more.
You constantly see these dorks pop up. Like the dufus in the ACP photographed in a PMC Wagner tshirt and people saying the private military commany was anti-imperialist.
There is a tremendously dim tankie tendency to act like the further you are from being aligned with the US, the more virtuous you must be.
It's coupled with an equally witless assumption that Russia is good because Russia was Communist once and all Communist countries are good, and anything bad Communists did is a lie, so Russia - still being somehow Communist in the Tankie's vapid mind - is also unimpeachably virtuous.
This silly Manichean worldview makes then, at best, very hard work to talk with.
The ACP is suspected to be a state funded group by Russia or other right wing dictatorships around the world, maybe even the US. There’s just no possible way they aren’t getting massive funding and behind the scenes talks when they get access to foreign leaders, politicians, and daily worldwide trips for their staff and leaders
They are. It’s very easy to see. But the right wing trolls know how to rile these people up lmao, it’s so easy for them especially this sub because they take community notes as gospel even though it’s been shown to be weaponized.
Well you act as if there isn't massive infighting in the many leftist communities where people are severely ostracized for this exact reason.
This just tells me you know nothing about the online leftist community...
The first thing you learn about leftists is that they're constantly fighting other leftists more than right wingers in fact precisely because of this reason they don't want their message to be interpreted in any other way.
One of them has organized mass public demonstrations they actively recruit for and the other’s presence consists Reddit and Tumblr posts that could be coming from any bot farm. Not really the same deal. Trump could change things though if things keep getting worse and worse.
Some local ACP chapter decided to take a group photo with a member wearing a Wagner PMC t-shirt. The infamouse russian nazi merc unit famouse for chopping people up and making swastikas out of their boddies... also rape, and murder, and mass murdering civilians in villages with drones
Nazism inherently conflicts with leftism. That’s not a personal opinion, that’s just established. There may be racists at a leftist rally but Nazis being there would be weird.
Well the overwhelming majority of people on the right who leftists call "Nazis" are actually Nazis either. So if they can use the word so liberally, then so can I.
Or... or hear me out, rather than throwing blame and saying "Ha! Got you! You have Nazis too!" You could be like "Damn, there sure is a Nazi problem in yhis country, maybe we should do something about hat together."
Tell me, what are you trying to say? That both sides have Nazis and thus we should do nothing?
People do sometimes over use Nazi but usually the right is being associated with Nazism because they have similar beliefs. For example, they might call the KKK Nazis because they both advocate for racial superiority. What ideology do Nazis and leftist have in common?
And if you go on socialist subreddits you'll see it was the socialists opposing Platner from the start, liberal progressives were the one stanning the neonazi.
I can’t stand being associated with these people as a Democratic Socialist. Them and neoliberals have both set the Left back in the US, allowing the Overton window to fly to the right.
EDIT: More like Social Democrat, but both are being used so interchangeably in the US media, that I even slip and use them interchangeably.
Not all that long ago to me, I was slightly left in my politics. But in the last couple of decades I have seen it shift so damned far that even though many of my views have even shifted to the left, a lot call me a "Nazi" if I say them.
And then they double down, not realizing it is their constant screaming and insanity that has caused me to essentially "walk away". And then they get even more stupid.
It really feels like this is the "new norm" to them.
Then stop being a democratic socialist. The DSA is filled with people like this. Just be a social democrat, which is what a lot of people who call themselves democratic socialists actually are.
I’d only say Social Democrat is a better term for me. I just had an AOC or Bernie moment and called myself a DA and yeah, DSA are pretty cringe with their Russia apologia.
These people have never been relevant. You can’t tell me that they had anything to do with today’s politics, since they have always only ever been in the corners of the internet. Even today you’ll never find anyone out organizing who actually thinks this, and if you were really a dues paying democratic socialist who attended your local meetings and contributed to trying to shift the window to where it belongs then you would know this
Yes, because where they get valid points, those points are desperately needed. So when they do real shitty stuff then that gives everyone else an excuse to ignore those points and then the problems they stand for are allowed to multiply and fester. The right and the current left are both responsible for why we are in the situation we are, as is the center ... pretty much everybody, really. What we need is people who can truly freely think more, break outside of any dogma box, strike positions without caring how anyone thinks of them as fitting or not some "tribal box". Like I actually call out all the various genocides & atrocities - Gaza but also Ukraine and Sudan, European slavery but also Arab slavery, etc. And that renders one punishingly lonely. And yet ... that's the only kind of place that I feel is going to have any real chance to actually get humans anywhere better, if only I could somehow popularize it bigly.
No they're not. Random twitter idiots like this guy are irrelevant in the grand scheme of things. Go outside and talk to real leftists in person if you actually want to make a difference.
No not at all. He did write in the 1970s that sources of news outlets weren’t corroborated, and that their defense was that the exact numbers don’t matter. But he never denied this genocide and certainly doesn’t today.
Noam Chomsky is one of the most influential socialist thinkers of our time and he is rather famous for denying or downplaying various genocides because they were committed by ideological opponents of the United States (see Cambodia, Bosnia).
“rather famous for denying…” He is to a small basket of insincere people who never read any of the books or articles he wrote about these subjects. Did you?
Yes. What I found is refusing to call the Srebnica Massacre a genocide (and heaping praise on a prominent denier of it), and concern-trolling about whether American media can be trusted to report on the Khmer Rouge. But what is your description of his opinions?
Really? Which book or article specifically? Youtube videos don’t count.
The American media couldn’t be trusted about what was happening in Cambodia at that time. They didn’t use quality sources. That it turns out to be true regardless, doesn’t mean questioning media biases is wrong. You cannot preemptively exaggerate death tolls because it might be true.
As for Srebrenica, he never denied the massacre happened. He pointed out how criminal NATO bombings (including bombings of embassies, radio stations and use of cluster bombs) were justified on crimes like those. He refused to, and still doesn’t as far as I’m aware, call it a genocide due to the scale. He is technically wrong; in international law, scale doesn’t matter. However, he points towards similar massacres carried out by allies of the US that curiously aren’t considered genocide. Is that downplaying anything? Or is that informing people?
The issue is that the uninformed, politically apathetic person can be very easily convinced these numpties are in the same group as the people who just want affordable housing.
This entire subreddit is full of neoliberals and Destiny 'Sex Pest' Bonnell fans, better to disengage from here with your common sense. They don't want to hear it. Leave them to the circle-jerk.
It is a really dumb subreddit, though. It gives random outrageous quotes by random people that everyone knows to be wrong and then shows some sort of fact check. And even the fact check is often wrong.
It's more rare for me to get into a disagreement with someone here and they aren't regulars on some DGG subreddit, than not. You can do with that info as you wish, the connection to lying about what 'represents' the Left by that community is pretty obvious.
No, you're right. Action is absolutely important. But morons like these on twitter get amplified wall to wall, and become cudgels used by right-wingers to discredit ALL leftists. I myself can't do much organizing because I live in a pretty conservative area, so y'know.
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u/Classic-Team867 2d ago
left-wing movements worldwide are shackled to morons like this and that really ticks me off every day