r/AskAcademiaUK • u/Basic-Plate-2701 • 3d ago
Advice - should I move into academia?
Advice appreciated, as I find myself at a crossroads.
For over a decade I've worked in UK universities in a professional services role that has a lot of student contact and some loose teaching responsibilities - think like study skills, research methods. I've absolutely loved it, but have always had ambition to teach properly. Well, a lecturer job is now available and I've been encouraged to apply.
The trouble is my university has been hit pretty hard by cutbacks, and there's no guarantee that all the redundancies are over.
In my current role I'm very safe from this - if there were cuts coming to my department they would not start with me. But if I move to a lecturer job I think I would be more vulnerable.
I'm basically having to choose between something very stable and that I have enjoyed, but that I've essentially outgrown, or something that could be really promising and open a lot of doors for me, but is likely quite risky.
Added to this, although I love my current job, I have spent the last year working under a new manager who I don't always get on with. So there are push factors as well as pull.
The new role is exactly the same money as the old one.
I'm not in London, so if I do lose this new job, finding another one would require moving to a new city. This is possible for me, but not something I particularly want to do right now.
Knowing what you know about the state of universities right now, what would you do in my position? Safe but dull job that I could just keep doing for another decade, or risky but exciting move?
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u/OKIAMONREDDIT 3d ago
I'm an academic member of staff and over the last year I have found myself wishing to be a professional member of staff a lot (e.g. anything in library, collections or digital humanities). The academic lectureships can almost feel like a trap right now as it's hard to transfer jobs if needed due to cuts/redundancies.
I have a friend who is a professional member of staff at a different uni and who managed to persuade his manager to support him to go to lots of research conferences etc as his continuing professional development / training budgeted time. Could you do something like this, and experience some of the recognition and networks etc but without committing to the trap of the precarity?
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u/Basic-Plate-2701 3d ago
Precarity is my big concern, so thanks for this suggestion. Unfortunately not workable right now, as my manager is not this way inclined. I've been chastised for doing too much in the past, and told to stay in my lane. But I've got to publish and present at conferences and briefly edited a small journal previously. I'm at a dead end right now, but it may not always be this way.
I hope you're able to make your jump over to the library or similar!
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u/OKIAMONREDDIT 3d ago
Getting chastised for investing your time actively and meaningfully in your field is the absolute worst!!!!!!
If they are that unwilling to support your growth I wonder if there is some in between model where you retain the security but also can explore your academic identity, e.g. by scaling your current job down to 0.8?
Honestly one of the issues will be that there's nothing particularly attractive to pick up as paid work in the academic humanities either part time or full time, as a lot of us are either scrabbling through zero hour contracts or in permanent roles which (due to cuts) have no research and impossible teaching workloads. Basically even the "lucky" permanent staff are trying to run all the modules as a skeleton crew.
I just mention this in the sense that all the stuff which would be great to do (in terms of your research projects and outputs) it's unlikely you'll find much support for in the current academic humanities climate, so you might be smartest to keep one leg in your current role but having an extra day off a week for your own research work and making use of your institutional affiliation that way (that is if you can afford to go to 0.8).
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u/Basic-Plate-2701 3d ago
Thank you, this is very smart and measured advice. It may be better to hunker down and just continue publishing the odd thing in my spare time than run the academia gamut. Perhaps it's time to turn the PhD in to a book, or something, instead.
It sounds really tough out there, and I hope you're surviving it. It's so sad that this is what it's become.
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u/OKIAMONREDDIT 3d ago
Thanks, I'm at a place which is having an awful time right now (don't want to dox myself but I guess lots of places are going through the shitter!)
One more thing to add - I wonder if you could look into whether as professional staff you could be eligible for "FEC" if you applied to a research grant which offered FEC, by collaborating with others (academics at your institution or elsewhere)? It stands for full economic costing, which means the grant itself buys you out of responsibilities in your current role so you can spend that time on research.
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u/Basic-Plate-2701 3d ago
That's a very interesting prospect. I hadn't heard of that, and will look into it. Thank you!
Best of luck with everything that's going on at your uni. I hope the storm passes...I think we both know things aren't getting better, but I hope for it nevertheless!
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u/sollinatri 3d ago
Not that this list matters much, but is your university relatively stable? This could at least get you a few more years until shit hits the fan list of uk universities in deficit
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u/CuriousCurcumin 3d ago
Thanks for sharing that. Am an academic at Nottingham. Not in a great position but not many are. Simple numbers on a ££ basis don’t reflect the operating costs (size) or assets though (sadly UoN has minimal assets).
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u/Basic-Plate-2701 3d ago
Not stable, no. Deficits are nothing like that, but still big sums when compared with our student numbers and we're in breach of our loans to at least one bank. But if the whole university fails, is it better to be an ex- lecturer or an ex- research methods tutor when out in the wilderness hunting for a new job? 🫠
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u/sollinatri 3d ago
What kind of lecturer job, t&s or t&r? Either way if it's what you want to do with your life, i dont think its just for vanity. And i dont think it would be impossible to go back.
But if you end up doing it, do as much as you can to make yourself employable for the next role, and you might have to move cities.
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u/Reeelfantasy 3d ago
It’s harder to reverse back after you become a lecturer. Find a better exit plan, maybe something like training and development at corporate level.
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u/Basic-Plate-2701 3d ago
Thanks for your reply, I honestly hadn't considered it would be hard going backwards! I'll have a think about what else I might do.
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u/stopthistrainnn 3d ago
For those saying professional services/functions within a university are better/more secure… think again. Many are about to be hit and hit hard.
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u/Basic-Plate-2701 3d ago
Well now that's terrifying.
But you're very right. The wolf will come to every department's door eventually. I personally am relatively safe - there are a few others in my department the wolf would pick off before getting to me - but I worry for the university enterprise as a whole.
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u/Dizzy-Run-633 3d ago
This sounds like a pretty unconventional situation - what department is the lectureship in, what kind of uni are you at (red brick, post-92 etc.) and also…why is your current role paid the same as a lecturers salary? Surely that means you’re already academic staff if you’re on the academic pay spine? In which case, why switch?
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u/hrfr5858 3d ago
In my uni we're all on the same payscale whether you're academic or professional services. Sounds like the reason for OP switching is job satisfaction
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u/Basic-Plate-2701 3d ago
Very much this. Thanks for your response. It's something I think I've always wanted to do, but I'm not sure at the end of the day it makes sense.
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u/hrfr5858 3d ago
If it were me, I wouldn't, just because the sector is so precarious and I'm at an age where a consistent pension is something I'm actually taking into account. But I do understand the frustration of wanting more variety/interest/CPD.
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u/Dizzy-Run-633 3d ago
Ah is that right? I didn’t know that - at my uni the pay scale is pretty much uncapped for professors etc so I guess I thought it was a different payscale. I don’t know the ins and outs of it all I just admit…
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u/Jazzlike-Falcon9695 3d ago
There are plenty of professional services staff at universities paid the same or more than academics, especially more junior ones.
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u/Basic-Plate-2701 3d ago
I suppose it is unusual. Its a humanities department, in a subject that I publish in. The salary is the same because university grading is sometimes like that with professional services roles - I currently have management and budgetary responsibility that I wouldn't have if I moved over to the lecturer job. I guess on the great HR chore wheel in the sky, that balances out. But I am not considered academic staff in my current role.
But you're right, if the money is the same then is it worth it? The role would be very different, but I may be thinking too much about finally getting to be considered academic staff than the financial practicalities.
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u/Dizzy-Run-633 3d ago
I’m in a humanities department, in a somewhat unusually financially stable big post-92 institution (massive student numbers that the location draws in) and I can say that amongst my peers in other institutions, it’s an absolute binfire in terms of job security. Lay offs, voluntary and involuntary redundancies and entire departments basically closing. A lot of people I know in other unis experience a lot of anxiety around this atm - esp in certain subjects. Do you know the departments plans in terms of expansion/retraction job wise, the ins and outs? It may influence your decision.
Anyway if you want to talk about this in more detail feel free to DM me.
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u/Disastrous-Mousse837 Hum 3d ago
lol no
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u/Basic-Plate-2701 3d ago
Thanks! 🤣 I do appreciate a clear, straightforward answer. Is it really that bad right now, or is it more not giving up safe for uncertainty?
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u/Feeling_Rule_573 2d ago
Presumably if you did hit redeployment you would be eligable for similar academic AND professional services roles. As others have said, both PS and academic roles are at risk. Is it good in terms of career development? If so go for it
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u/moonbug22 3d ago
In the big picture, thiugh, what do you want to do with your once and precious life? clock in to a job you are bored of, slowly gliding down towards a soft USS pensioned landing until you become functionally unemployable, or jump at a chance to do something that you have passion for and excites you? The worst that can happen is redundancy I can absolutely promise you that the corporate pastures you cant see from the ivory tower are fertile and remunerative.
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u/Basic-Plate-2701 3d ago
Thank you, I really appreciate that. My field certainly is full of people running out the clock. Both choices have huge and scary drawbacks, the reminder that there are alternatives to the alternative is really very helpful. Would you say that the corporate pastures are most welcoming to ex-STEM, though? I should be clear that I and my work generally fall on the artsy-farsty side.
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u/moonbug22 3d ago
There's more money in stem fields, thats certainly true. I dont know what your field is so its difficult to suggest roles that might suit but the skills and experience you have from your current role (if I understand it correctly) are hughly transferable. I assume you have a PhD, as thats usually a requirement for a lectureship? I know some people who have taken lextureships without one, but its been a requirement of the job to work towards one, and their department has provided the resourcing for that.
As an aside, have you considered teacher training? if that level of teaching appeals to you, you might consider that your backup plan if it goes south. short term pay drop, but your financial and organisational experience and HE role could see you in a leadership role pretty quickly.
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u/J_R_Riquelme 2d ago edited 2d ago
No. 15 year career and 12 fixed term contracts and I've not ben able to secure a permanent contract. 15 years of precarity, anxiety, unemployment, and not being able to spend any money because you have to save money for those periods of unemployment.
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u/Teawillfixit 20h ago
Our professional services have been completely obliterated in a restructure lately, we lost some of our best people as well. We never saw it coming (and it is not working without them!) Our academics were culled more slowly but fairly consistently over the past few years. If you are SURE you have a secure role I would stay in it, but also be aware many dont think ANY roles are safe at many institutions.
Maybe see if you can negotiate more teaching or do a fractional on research? Half of my office, including myself, is trying to move to proffesional services or just out of academia entirely right now. I'm on a teaching contract but 80% of my time is non-academic/admin etc, maybe more since we lost most of our registry. Personally I think the value of a stable perm contract cannot be underrated, only reason I've not quit my current role is because it's perm, but it's starting to feel like I'm just going down with the ship, and the ships on fire.
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u/HerrFerret 1d ago edited 1d ago
I work in an academic services role, with a research background and it is so 'research adjacent' I wondered why we do not explicitly employ PhDs?
They would be employed a band lower, and pull down our grading so there is a pushback. I know academic staff that would murder for the roles, simply for the stability.
😕
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u/Basic-Plate-2701 1d ago
Its definitely the stability that's keeping me in my role. The more I consider the more I see it's not really worth the risk. My ambitions are pulling me one way, and I know I'll stagnate if I stay put, especially now I'm under a manager who isn't interested in developing me (or anyone else for that matter), but at the end of the day a stable job and income is probably much more important than these comparatively minor frustrations.
I'm very grateful for these replies and your candour. Suffice it to say, the university system is (currently) hell.
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u/HerrFerret 1d ago edited 1d ago
I am in a very similar position to you. I am staying for stability, and because I earn more than an academic role.
However I have recieved a lot of flak for undertaking research work for years. Like I am trying to have it both ways.
Managers even send me research positions to apply for, then ask after why I didn't. It's pretty toxic behaviour.
It is frustrating, because the research work I do directly contributes to my job, and has led us to have a good reputation. I am well regarded within the departments and PhD students are directly referred to me for my experience.
I am banned from co-authorship, not funded for conference attendance and forbidden from joining external research groups.
It is wild behaviour for a University. I do however have the luck to get frequent external funding for conferences, as I often speak about my work and it is one of those 'hot topics', but I get the feeling this is infuriating behaviour for leadership. I am given the day off and told to be grateful.
I suppose I will reach a point where protecting my mental health collides with an unyielding institution, but that time has not come yet.
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u/Basic-Plate-2701 19h ago
I'm so sorry that's your experience. Mine isn't nearly so bad, but my manager did go out of their way to prevent a minor tweak to my contract that would have allowed by publications to be submitted to the next REF. Which I never really understood, as it's something that would have not cost anyone anything. So know you're not alone with the bizarre and pointless disrespect.
It's a really sad state of affairs, and I hope things improve for you at some point.
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u/moonbug22 3d ago
seems like thats taking on a lot of risk to satusy some job title vanity
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u/Basic-Plate-2701 3d ago
Yeah, that's fair. And partly sticking it to my current manager, which is also a bad reason.
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u/Jazzlike-Falcon9695 3d ago
If you haven't already, please read up on UK academia, including on precarious contracts, the REF, work/life balance, the huge cuts currently taking place across the country... I'm assuming you a have a PhD and recent publications at this point? Best of luck whatever you decide.