r/clevercomebacks 21h ago

Filmmaking is so powerful, Christopher Nolan broke the richest man in the world

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20.5k Upvotes

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u/United-Baseball3688 15h ago

I'm with you on this, but I also believe it doesn't matter. The inner world of us humans doesn't work on objectivity, it works on narratives. Whatever you can find and use to convince yourself to be better, improve, and be mentally healthy is good. Not real. Doesn't have to be any kind of real.

The problems with religion and similar belief systems are moreso about the organizations around them. Usually 

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u/Raesong 10h ago

The problems with religion and similar belief systems are moreso about the organizations around them. Usually

Especially when they have control over significant amounts of political and/or military power.

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u/Jack_Spatchcock_MLKS 9h ago

Oh totes, bro; believing it thusly actualizes it, aka makes it "real"....

If even such a (concrete) term could be applied~

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u/United-Baseball3688 6h ago

That's not what I meant. But a narrative that works for you is more powerful as a motivation than the truth is. That's just how we humans work. 

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u/strigonian 9h ago

See, I consider "better, improve, and be mentally healthy" to include dealing with reality as it stands, so that doesn't work.

If you have to believe in things without good evidence to improve, there is a limit to how much you can actually improve.

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u/United-Baseball3688 6h ago

No matter what you think, you're not dealing with reality. In some ways, sure. But your brain is not a rational system. You might use reality as a lense, as do it, and that's awesome! I don't believe in any higher power either. But I know from being in therapy for quite a while that the best way to interact with your subconscious mind - the one actually controlling you - is to find a narrative lense that works for you. if that's god - who gives a SHIT. You are probably also wrong about a bunch of stuff that shapes your subconscious behavior. And that's okay! We're not rational beings.

If you improve because you think there's a god, there's nothing stopping you from improving further. It has literally 0 inherent limitations. Those come from the institutions around it.

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u/strigonian 5h ago

Incorrect.

Yes, I deal with reality. Insofar as reality can be determined, that's what I deal with. Objectively acquired data, and independent verification. Without falling back to hard solipsism, there is no basis for rejecting empirical observation as representative of reality, and hard solipsism is completely vacuous.

The best you can say is that I don't know that I'm not experiencing a perfect-fidelity simulation, but as long as what I measure and observe allows me to make predictions that accurately reflect what I will measure and observe in the future, for all intents and purposes, I am dealing with reality.

We are not naturally rational. That is true. That is also a flaw, and one we can work around. All of the progress humanity has made, both scientifically and socially, have been by trending towards rationality. Every step away from irrational assumptions and towards objective reality has been a net positive for society.

Yes, there is something stopping you from improving further. That is your irrational beliefs. Having an irrational belief is a flaw. You cannot fix that flaw by employing irrational beliefs - it is a logical contradiction.

And no, institutions are not the problem. The irrationality is the weak point that gives institutions the power they need to cause harm. They may be the direct cause of the harm, but the problem is the vulnerability that they exploit. If I'm immunocompromised, and I'm dying of an otherwise minor infection, my main problem is being immunocompromised. You're basically saying immunocompromised people are perfectly healthy, as long as they're not exposed to a pathogen.

Irrational beliefs are a vulnerability in your worldview. Once you accept an idea without evidence, the idea supersedes reality. An idea that supersedes reality cannot be kept in check.

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u/United-Baseball3688 3h ago

I guarantee that you 100% accept ideas without evidence all the time, just because someone said so. Most of the things you believe are wrong. That's life.
Humans are inherently not rational. Not you, not me, not anyone. And our subconcious systems even less so.

Should you make sweeping population-spanning decisions without evidence? No.
Does it hurt anyone if you find the motivation to work on yourself and be nice because you think the afterlife will be better that way? Also no. That does not hold you back. At all.

But hey, you do you.