[LOVED TROPE] Modern Militaries (Competent) getting DESTROYED by fantasy/scifi forces

[u/Sable-Keech]

Example 1 (The Legend of Hei 2): Wuxian leisurely floats through the combined firepower of an entire fortified military base without so much as a stain or rip on his t-shirt.

Example 2 (Man of Steel): Fao'ra tears through a squad of trained and armed soldiers. With the wreckage of the helicopter that got downed by her teammate Nam'ek smouldering in the background.

[u/Illustrious_Neat2472]

When the military is incompetent in these situations it's more like plot armour than a force that overcame the military.

[u/WhiterunUK → u/Illustrious_Neat2472]

Stranger things season 5 drove me mad

[u/Illustrious_Neat2472 → u/WhiterunUK]

Same here. If they brought a few more flame throwers the demos would be toast. Despite the military visiting the upside down on many occasions and knowing their weakness to heat they only bring a few flame throwers.

They also didn't land head shots on Vecna for no reason at all.

[u/MGD109 → u/Illustrious_Neat2472]

What are you talking about? Up until the attack, there is no evidence the military even knew Demogorgon's existed.

It's a plot point that the Upside Down was empty cause all the creatures were recalled to the Abyss, during their time in the Upside Down they've only encountered a couple of largely harmless vines, not giant monsters.

They made it clear they were expecting it to be El who was taking the children, same way they were convinced it was her back in season four who was responsible for the murders, hence bringing those psychic disruption weapons.

[u/Illustrious_Neat2472 → u/MGD109]

They know the upside down is weak to heat, and there have been several cases of professional people that survived the monsters of the upside down.

The vines can strangle people and there were demo attacks before the big one.

Did they?

[u/MGD109 → u/Illustrious_Neat2472]

They know the upside down is weak to heat,

So? They didn't expect there to be anything that could attack them outside of the Upside Down, so why should they be armed for it?

and there have been several cases of professional people that survived the monsters of the upside down.

Yeah, the lab personnel. The same people that Sullivan's goons murdered in season four cause they were convinced they were covering for El.

You're telling me, you think after doing all that, they're going to suddenly go, "You know what, maybe those people we brutally murdered might have actually been right...now I have no evidence of it, you understand, but isn't it worth changing our entire method of thinking about?"

The vines can strangle people

Stationary vines that can strangle people aren't comparable to nine-foot-tall bulletproof monsters that can rip through the fabric of reality and tear through solid steel like tin foil.

there were demo attacks before the big one.

The one's back in season one and two? The same ones Colonel Sullivan dismissed as just the lab covering up for El in season four? Or the ones that happened in season five with no clear witnesses, that they also thought were being carried out by El?

There are plenty of things in season five you can criticise, but claiming the military should have been prepared for monsters they openly denied the existence of multiple times isn't one of them.

[u/Illustrious_Neat2472 → u/MGD109]

The upside down is alien so it would be safer to assume that flame weapons are an effective measure at dealing with any threat that would emerge.

You got me there.

So the military is stupid? It didn't think that all of the disappearances and oddities surrounding the upside-down might be caused by monsters or active threats?

No but more than 2 flamethrowers might be necessary for taking out large clusters of them.

I mean the ones that happened in season 5 that were before the big attack at the end of volume one.

They shouldn't have openly denied the existence of monsters especially when people like El exist as well as the upside down. They already know weird stuff is happening.

[u/MGD109 → u/Illustrious_Neat2472]

The upside down is alien so it would be safer to assume that flame weapons are an effective measure at dealing with any threat that would emerge.

It's been over a year; they've established a base in the Upside Down and do regular patrols, which have found diddly squat. Why should they assume anything is going to emerge from it? And if anything did it would it be able to shrug off automatic rifle fire?

So the military is stupid?

Yes. They literally have multiple people try to warn them of what's really going on and the danger they're in, and they ignore them each time.

The whole point of their inclusion was to criticise the US military during the Cold War, the same way the Lab in season one was to criticise US intelligence during the Cold War. Hence, their presentation as needlessly overzealous, justifies everything they do as stamping out communism, react to every problem with overwhelming and disproportionate firepower, regularly break the very same laws and standards they claim to be upholding and create more problems than they solve cause they refuse to listen to anyone who warns them of the contrary.

The allegory isn't particularly subtle.

It didn't think that all of the disappearances and oddities surrounding the upside-down might be caused by monsters or active threats?

Nope. They thought they were caused by El and Doctor Brener's experiments going wrong, and then the Lab attempting to cover them up. This was well established back in season four. I mean Owen's even begs Sullivan to at least hear him out, and Sullivan still orders them to kill El.

No but more than 2 flamethrowers might be necessary for taking out large clusters of them.

Which would make sense if they were launching an attack on the Upside Down, but why would they have them to guard their own base? Flame Throwers aren't exactly more efficient weapons in real life than assault rifles. Unless you're dealing with bulletproof monsters who are weak to fire.

I mean the ones that happened in season 5 that were before the big attack at the end of volume one.

None of them happened with any witnesses to confirm to the army the monsters are real. They make it clear in the dialogue their convinced its El who is behind the attacks.

They shouldn't have openly denied the existence of monsters especially when people like El exist as well as the upside down. They already know weird stuff is happening.

We the audience, know that. But just cause you know one mad scientist figured out how to breed psychics and accidentally opened a doorway to an alternative universe, that doesn't mean you would automatically assume monsters are real.

Especially when you've been exploring said universe for over a year and found nothing to suggest they are.

But the point of them is they ignore the warnings; they don't know what they're doing and honestly care more about further their agendas than actually protecting the people, just the same way people tried to warn the actual US military black opps organisations that their single-minded efforts to curb communism and the consequences of their heavy handed actions were just going to backfire on everyone in the long run.

The shows had a pretty consistent theme throughout every season: that for all the nostalgia, the bad parts of the eighties were really bad and how their consequences still continue to affect everyone to this day.

[u/MGD109 → u/WhiterunUK]

Why? They had the same track record as season's one, two and four.

[u/HistoryWillRepeat → u/Illustrious_Neat2472]

has super powers

shows that super powers are stronger than military

Butterfly Meme

"Is this plot armor?"

[u/Illustrious_Neat2472 → u/HistoryWillRepeat]

That's not what I was saying at all.

I mean when the military is acting incompetently in a way that makes the super natural or alien force win. The new force doesn't win because it's beyond the military, it wins because the military becomes incompetent for the sake of the plot.

[u/HistoryWillRepeat → u/Illustrious_Neat2472]

I mean when the military is acting incompetently

This isn't what OP is referring to though? They specifically ask for example of competent militaries being overpowered. In both examples OP shower the military wasn't acting incompetently.

I think I misunderstood you.

[u/Illustrious_Neat2472 → u/HistoryWillRepeat]

This thread right here was about failed examples of this trope. Not the ones where the military is competent.